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Madge - hit or miss?
Last Post 15 Jun 2004 09:51 AM by john@soundweb.ie. 35 Replies.
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john@soundweb.ieUser is Offline
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john@soundweb.ie

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15 Jun 2004 09:51 AM
    anyone arsed going to slane? what price are tickets and why has this woman never bothered to play here before now?
    BinokularUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 09:57 AM
    85 euro, seems a bit steep, but not as bad as initially suggested (150 euro). Can't be arsed going, but then again I was too lazy to go to the Pixies either.
    klootfanUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 10:09 AM
    Nah. wouldnt be my cup of tea. Its strange that the have picked an act to play Slane which would appeal alot more to one of the sexes then the other. This means that they will be relying on trying to sell 80,000 tickets to alot smaller customer base. Or are there quite a lot of men out there who enjoy her stuff ?? I cant see how they might balance this out. I dont reckon it will sell out as quick as last year anyway
    El DuderinoUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 10:40 AM
    Who is supporting her at Slane? It'd want to be a legendary line up to A)justify the ticket price and B)make up for the really sh*tty main act
    BinokularUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 12:37 PM
    I'm kind of amused by the last two posts. If you don't like the main act, why bother going at all? Ok there might be a "must see" support act, but more likely not. The ticket price is steep, but people seem to be willing to sell their kidneys for tickets everytime some smug, complacent "legend" from the 60s plays here. Maybe not your cup of tea, but I'm pretty sure Madonna will sell a respectable though probably not record-breaking number of tickets. Klootfan, I'm a (straight) bloke and I think Madonnas great. I like pop music (there! I've said it), and Madonna makes good pop music, simple as that. After 20 years, its daft to dismiss the womans a throwaway novelty. Yes, she has released a lot of duds, but "like a prayer" is great. The whole "Ray of Light" an "Music" albums are fantastic. "American Life" is pretty rubbish, but you can't have it all eh? So what if she manipulates the media, so what if she has cynically cherry-picked her collaborators to keep up with the latest trends (William Orbit, Mirwais, etc.). She has made good pop records and at the end of the day (to borrow a football cliche) thats all that counts. I find it funny that in other threads people are being praised for admitting to liking country music, when in reality theres no stigma. The hipsters are clamouring over each other to prove their authentic country credentials, while the idea of guy liking pop music is, well, just a bit suspicious really. Anyway, if Madonna really does appeal mainly to women, it actually makes a lot of commercial sense. The main reasons I won't be seeing Madonna live are that as said already, I'm just too lazy to make the trip and also its not really the authentic Madonna experience. Madonna is the original MTV star. Seeing her in a music video is ironically more the reality of what Madonna is about than seeing her live.
    El DuderinoUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 01:13 PM
    Fair enough, she had her day once upon a time and if you liked her that's up to you, and maybe sh*tty main act was a bit harsh. She has done her bit in the whole development of music, or rather as Binokular pointed out, the development of music videos. However, this whole idea of aging artists playing these tours as if they were at the top of their game is getting all too common. And whats worse is that it's becoming more and more common, and more and more expensive. The main problem i see with the Slane gig (apart from not being a Madonna fan) is that it is profiteering in its purest form. She could've made the tickets a reasonable price if she wanted to but these kind of acts don't seem to care that alot of their original fan base might not necessarily be able to afford these exorbitant prices. When a artist shows this kind of disdain for their fans I can't really see how they can be defended
    Rev JulesUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 03:18 PM
    quote:
    I think Madonnas great. I like pop music (there! I've said it), and Madonna makes good pop music, simple as that...The whole "Ray of Light" an "Music" albums are fantastic...I find it funny that in other threads people are being praised for admitting to liking country music, when in reality theres no stigma. The hipsters are clamouring over each other to prove their authentic country credentials, while the idea of guy liking pop music is, well, just a bit suspicious really.
    Oh, how can I not respond to my fellow moderator on this one, especially since i agree and disagree with him in equal measure about the same things ! Ok, here goes. First off, one of the Irish music industries biggest country music fans, and someone who had admitted in interview that he was persecuted for it growing up in Kiltimagh by all the rockers is none other than...Pop Supremo Louis Walsh ! Not sure what the last point meant. Hey, maybe we could all get together and set up CA (Country Anonymous..."Hi, My name is Steve. I listen to Alan Jackson....ten hours a day, every day") Second, 'Music' is Madge's 'gone country' record (or at least that's what she said in the run up to its release). Three, the hipsters are not clamouring over their credentials, they don't know enough to clamour, and Jack White should be hung from the nearest lamp post in Austin Texas for what he did to Loretta Lynn. I have been to three seriously important country gigs in Ireland in the last six months, Rodney Crowell, Dr Ralph Stanley and Sharon Vaughan, and I didn't see many hipsters there. I did however see alot of middle aged guys with toupees and Pringle jumpers though (myself excepted, not being middle aged, toupee wearing or the owner of anything by Pringle), oh yes, and Mickey Harte (not to be confused with Americana legend Mickey Hart). What a difference an E makes !
    QsySueUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 03:44 PM
    I think the reason for the huge ticket prices is that this is more like a Broadway production than a concert. My brother's going to the show in Philly, I'll let you all know how it was. :)
    john@soundweb.ieUser is Offline
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    john@soundweb.ie

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    15 Jun 2004 04:16 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by john@soundweb.ie
    ...and why has this woman never bothered to play here before now?
    i.m.o. she hasn't earned a slane regardless of her life on MTV (when it was MusicTV i mean, but thats another days work!)... you gotta earn a slane gig by showing some regard for the fans of this country
    the perfect cousinUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 05:12 PM
    Ah Jayzuz lads. Its only music. Gettin "Now That's Wha' I Call Music" this weeeeekend at the markeh. Good beats, deadly buzz yeah! Big shou' ou' teh me possie in Courtown. Story Rasher, Bulletproof an' Ammo? I'll be down to see yiz for me holidays with the ma an' da in the august! Savage.
    Rev JulesUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 06:24 PM
    ...Four, is liking Madonna some kind of 21st Century version of 'Showtunes and Barbara Streisand' kick ? Like ? Hey, theres an idea for a Radio Show, 'Queer Ear for the Straight Guy' Sample Dialogue: "OH MY GOD, Meatloaf, throw it out. What YOU need is some Madonna. She's simply FABULOUS !!!" (Just want to apologise for any negative stereotyping that might have occured in that last paragraph. I fully accept that you can be gay and rock out. Exhibit A: Ocean Colour Scene. For the record, I am going to stand up and say that I am going to see Madge in Slane. The Missus has insisted, the records are on her car stereo non stop. I have been give the collected lyrics and told to learn them off by heart so that we can share the experience of singing along together. There is no escape for me ! Want a review when I get back ?
    Rev JulesUser is Offline
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    15 Jun 2004 06:50 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by the perfect cousin
    Good beats, deadly buzz yeah! Big shou' ou' teh me possie in Courtown. Story Rasher, Bulletproof an' Ammo?
    Perfect Cousin, are you not supposed to be studying for what remains of your Leaving Cert ? Hmm ?
    BinokularUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 12:31 PM
    Hey Jules, I have to admit I was kinda trying to provoke a reaction (thoroughly irresponsible behaviour for a moderator!) and its worked! but hey, it makes for interesting discussions. OK the "hipster" comment regarding country music was a bit extreme, but you gotta admit, country has never been more credible, OK maybe a lot of the stuff people are listening to isn't "real" country but I'll leave that debate to the afficionados. I can understand you bringing up Louis Walsh, but to me, he is a man who knows very little about pop music, just a lot about show business. His management style seems to be more like someone involved in the cabaret scene, he used to manage Linda Martin apparently. Even most of his so called "pop" acts are not really pop. None of them are real pop stars with perhaps the exception of Samantha Mumba (and even then she kind of morphed into a poor R&B act). People just give Westlife and Boyzone the label "pop" because its mainly listened to by young girls who can be found falling off their heels after a few bacardi breezers. OK this all might sound a bit silly because by strict definition pop music can just be described as music thats popular. However to me theres a bit more to it than that. To me pop music is about distilling music down until all your left with is the fun bits. Westlifes bloated ballads sound more like they could be used to sell life assurance or washing powder or something than being pop. Granted, the Carpenters wrote a song for a bank ad, I'll give you that, but I hope your getting my point (I'm even confusing myself here). Its hard to define what pop music is, but westlife and boyzone are not it, while Brian Wilson, Kim Wilde, Blondie, The Bangles, B-52s, The Monkees, Abba, Betty Boo, Human League, Bananarama, Madonna, Kylie ad even (God forbid) S-Club 7 are. Confused? You should be! Music is Madonnas country record? Well she wears a big ol' stetson on the cover so it must be. Hey, this is a woman who espouses the latest new age mystical hippie crap and calls it "spirituality" Madonna the new "Showtunes and Barbara Streisand kick"? I hope not, I was just responding to the assumption that Madonnas audience is predominantly female, which maybe true, but I don't think any bloke growing up in the 80s didn't fancy Madonna (not a patch on Kim Wilde though). My mum used to like Barbara Streisand and musicals, did me 'ead in, nearly driving me to random acts of violence. Better stop now, this is all getting a bit too Freudian. Come to think of it, isn't Meatloaf a bit of a Showtunes guy himself? I believe hes done some musicals and "Bat out of Hell" is more light opera than it is Heavy Metal!
    John DoeUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 01:30 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rev Jules
    quote:
    Originally posted by the perfect cousin
    Good beats, deadly buzz yeah! Big shou' ou' teh me possie in Courtown. Story Rasher, Bulletproof an' Ammo?
    Perfect Cousin, are you not supposed to be studying for what remains of your Leaving Cert ? Hmm ?
    He's too busy watching the Aslan at Vicar Street DVD.
    John DoeUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 01:34 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rev Jules
    Hey, theres an idea for a Radio Show, 'Queer Ear for the Straight Guy' Sample Dialogue: "OH MY GOD, Meatloaf, throw it out. What YOU need is some Madonna. She's simply FABULOUS !!!" (Just want to apologise for any negative stereotyping that might have occured in that last paragraph. I fully accept that you can be gay and rock out. Exhibit A: Ocean Colour Scene.
    Pah. Tom Robinson was rocking out and singing how he was "Glad To Be Gay" in the dark days of the '70s, unlike now when, apparently, gay is the new straight.
    Rev JulesUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 02:17 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by John Doe Tom Robinson was rocking out and singing how he was "Glad To Be Gay" in the dark days of the '70s
    Ehh, isn't Tom Robinson now straight as in... In 1988 the British press discovered that he was living with a woman and made a big issue of it. In 1990 he turned 40 and became a father. By the age of 42 he was married and had two children. I understand he is now called 'The Artist Formerly Known as Gay' So yes, Gay is the new Straight, in more ways than one
    Rev JulesUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 02:38 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Binokular
    you gotta admit, country has never been more credible...I don't think any bloke growing up in the 80s didn't fancy Madonna... isn't Meatloaf a bit of a Showtunes guy himself?
    Oh man, ok, When I see Heads in Whelans enthusing about Reba McEntire and Alan Jackson then, yes, I will accept that Country is credible...For the record, Ryan Adams, Will Oldham, Uncle Tupelo and so on are not Country...so anyone out there thinking of trying it on, dont. I actually didn't fancy Madonna...I saw what she did to Willem Dafoe with broken glass and candle wax...I preferred the soft, bouncy, latin spirit of yer one who sang 'boys boys boys' as her top came off in a swimming pool. Oh yes, and Suzi Quatro. Yum Is Meatloaf a Gay Icon ? Hmm, as he says himself, 'I Would Do Anything For Love But I Won't Do That'. What is 'That' ? Eh no, don't think he is. Jim Steinman also produced The Sisters of Mercy, and I don't think they could be branded gay...or could they ?
    BinokularUser is Offline
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    16 Jun 2004 03:04 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Rev Jules Hmm, as says himself, 'I Would Do Anything For Love But I Won't Do That'. What is 'That' ?
    As Jay Leno once quipped, 'That' would be "eat a salad". Hey, I just said Meatloaf did showtunes, I wasn't implying anything else, honest! I think he'd openly admit that what he does is more theatre than rock and roll.
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    17 Jun 2004 07:05 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Binokular
    the idea of guy liking pop music is, well, just a bit suspicious really.
    I must admit, the above phrase by my fellow moderator has stuck with me. There you are, in your de rigeur grey Ramones T-Shirt, with a copy of NME under your arm strolling down the street listening to your I-Pod. Passers by think you are listening to the latest lo-fi release by Hammell on Trial, White Stripes, Franz Ferdinand or some other credible rock act...but no...you are indulging in Guilty Pop Pleasures, those pop songs by the likes of....S Club 7...that you secretly love. What are you hidden desires ? Here are a few of mine 'Dancehall Days' - Wayne Chung 'Rock DJ' - Robbie Williams 'The Lion Sleeps Tonight' - Tight Fit 'Whenever, Wherever' - Shakira 'LA Ex' - Rachel Stevens 'Hit Me Baby One More Time' - Britany Spears (I so know I am going to pay for that one) 'I Want To Be Free' - Toyah Willcox (Oh man, my first gig in the RDS)
    BinokularUser is Offline
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    17 Jun 2004 09:46 AM
    Jules, this whole sbuject of pop probably deserves its own thread! where do I start? Theres just so many songs I could add! For starters: A large chunk of the combined back catalogue of Bananarama, The Bangles, Destinys Child (does that count as pop or RnB or both?) Human League and Yazoo. "Shoes On, Boots Off" - LUV (imagine a Dutch all girl version of Abba) "Kids in America" - Kim Wilde "Like a Prayer" - Madonna "Can't get you out of my head" and "Slow" - Kylie Minogue "say what you want" - Nelly Furtado (does that count?) I have to agree with some of your choices too Jules, Lion Sleeps tonight is great (and hilarious if you catch me trying sing along too as I try to stretch my deep baritone to its upper limits). "LA Ex" - all I can say is that Alison Goldfrapp must be kicking herself. Shakira makes me smile too but perhaps for all the wrong reasons, those lyrics crack me up, especially the way she sings them with such sincerity and passion despite having such a tenuous grasp of English. After saying that, I hope I never accidentally bump into Shakira, she sounds like the kind of girl who could easily kick the crap out of anyone.
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