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stardust
Last Post 25 Aug 2003 09:20 PM by shewolf. 27 Replies.
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shewolfUser is Offline
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shewolf

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25 Aug 2003 09:20 PM
    just reading the amount of discussion, argument, vitriol and wisdom that the workingclass gig topic started in the tangent of talent vs PR and networking skill, artistry vs business. I was out this weekend just gone, prowlin around some events that involved large signed bands/stars whatever way you like to call it. the thing is about these events that i noticed is that they really double over into playing and schmoozing. The guys (it was all men in this case) who were playing were into their buzz and all travelling together, but they were also socializing together, cheering each other on and networking. several of them i was chatting to all had gotten gigs and work this way by being around knowing each other etc. but still it boiled down to the essential ingredients talent and v.hard work there was one band involved who were irish and i'm not mentioning names, they are trying extremely hard to put themselves out there and they are succeeding at this particular aspect of it. but when they played they were s**te. it is indeed astounding how far they have got on the strenght of their networking skills but they won't be going much further i can assure you if this is what a totally tuneless and overinflated band with no innate star quality can do then imagine what a talented band can do wiht a little bit of neck. you do need a lot of neck, this band sure had it, they didn't mind being totally ridiculous just to get themselves hanging out with bigger better musicians. but they were the best example i've seen of if you haven't got it, you haven't got it. i suppose at least they are getting to live some of their dream out though. god loves a tryer. you've definitely gotta have stardust and that stardust is really just about loving playing,and then some, so you can get to do it permanently. this guy, the lead singer, (because later on at the club etc the rest of his band was nowhere in sight) was trying way too hard though, an asshole, anything but an artist. you know, the record deal isn't everything especially when you see assholes getting them. i think its important to realise the music is the thing and really f**king kick out the jams becasue it will get you everywhere. if it feels really good don't doubt it, be joyful welcome other members of your own tribe, because real artists are a tribe that recognise each other, the ambition should be internal, concentrating on your personal best reaching heights with what your'e doing. it definitely won't miss. i haven't seen mouse play but i read the gripe on the WCH section how they've played all over the country etc adn its disillusioning them -why?- cos they think the gigging is a means to an end? it shouldn't be, they should be doing it cos they love it. but i do think recording demos and passing them out and around is vital adn keeping at it too although i have to say if they were promised their slot and they obviously are a famously busy band on the scene then the asshole organiser who now crosses the street to avoid them should be cornered and grilled about his actions they shouildn't let anyone dis them like this he should be shot really, the music business and scene and magic and buzz doesn't just rely on bands good, bad or ugly but also movers and shakers, audiences, managers, artists, good looking girls, producers, passionate people with talents in many areas that are also essential to creating a real scene you could have a million cool talented original bands out there- without a receptive connection to people who will pick them up? its useless really without the recievers! presumably the guy organising it in question, was the brian carroll dude? answers on vellum please
    flagmanUser is Offline
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    flagman

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    26 Aug 2003 08:09 AM
    You should get an editor love. Sheesh.
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    shewolf

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    26 Aug 2003 10:07 AM
    tired wolf, y'know i had spent the last few days rockin n rollin. its great when the way you say it is as good as what you're saying. but its more important you've something to say in the first place kinda like what i mean about the music in my rant above. i just love to get carried away though, less criticism more reply please NEXT.....
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    26 Aug 2003 10:42 AM
    So what you're saying is, it's not what you know, but who you know that counts? I'm sure most people believe this about something or other at some point in their life.
    dirtypropagandaUser is Offline
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    dirtypropaganda

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    26 Aug 2003 04:53 PM
    u may not wanna name names but i do...i said it it at that working class thing and i will reiterate it...HALITE : not thanks!!! i wasnt at slane so i dont know what they were like..i can just imagine they were about as good as they can be..ie: not very! shewolf ur insights are longwinded but nevertheless interesting. lovely hurling!
    dirtypropagandaUser is Offline
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    dirtypropaganda

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    26 Aug 2003 05:00 PM
    i meant to say.....HALITE : no thanks!! but i dunno how to edit. just to elaborate i have to say hats off to graham hopkins he has achieved a lot for a guy his age.... i seen him play in dalymount park supporting faith no more ten summers ago at sunstroke 93' drumming with my little funhouse..at the time i was in a s**t band at school and really looked up to people like hopkins for being out there and really livin the rock n roll dream..he then went on to join one of my favourite irish bands of all time therapy?...so fair f**ks to the guy....i just cannot warm to halite though...they just dont do it for me.
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    shewolf

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    26 Aug 2003 07:53 PM
    well i'm glad someone is drawing their own conclusions! Yes who you know is damn important flagman, but you will hit a cutoff point if your'e crap. but to be honest there's more to life than just getting there, there's actually striving to produce something satisfactory to you, i wouldn't fancy meeting GH in another ten years cos he's an obnoxious jerk now and i can only cringe inside to think what he might think of himself in another couple of years. he has spent way too much time trying to develop the walk and not enough time on the talk and this is the result a lack of perspective, graft, and artistry. A big inflated arsehole who spends his time trying to force his way up others arses, But let us to other, more edifying discussions befitting real stars and artists. what constitutes real star quality in your opinion?
    fezUser is Offline
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    26 Aug 2003 07:58 PM
    Jesus she wolf put down that spliff and start using some punctuation! But yeah your right in what you say about the contacts thing. We all know that there's a handful of bands on the Dublin circuit who are absolute muck (not mentioning names either, it's not worth the f**king abuse), yet they still seem to be getting substantial publicity and doors opened. I was always of the impression that recognition will always come if a band a)have serious talent and b)gigs their asses off but now I'm not so sure.No disrespect to genuinly hard-working bands who use networking to their advantage, nothing wrong with that. It just seems that here's so much f**king schmoozing in the circuit that mediocre bands can get places with contacts in the right places.
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    26 Aug 2003 08:10 PM
    fez my friend you'll be glad to read i'm clean tonight! (hows zat for punctuation?)-(jesus now i can't stop and i'm firing on all cylinders) from one extreme to another. yeah i saw it at close range this weekend there's only one thing for it to consider rolling out the heavy artillery and attack on all fronts hype costume riffs get invited to teh parties shmooze up a little just a little mind -cos remember your better than these assholes the power of suggestion and a pinch of star complex if you know your music is good never did any band any harm. i do think word spreads if your'e really good but this city is also full of assholes who wouldn't know rock n roll if it if it snake hipped up to them and offered its fellating tongue out to them
    mickUser is Offline
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    26 Aug 2003 09:16 PM
    quote:
    We all know that there's a handful of bands on the Dublin circuit who are absolute muck (not mentioning names either, it's not worth the f**king abuse), yet they still seem to be getting substantial publicity and doors opened.
    all about opinions who is muck and who isnt... no doubt there's folk who think the band i'm in are s**te and dont deserve doors opend etc. and vice versa i think that about other bands... if you're half decent ie. can play your instruments and have ok tunes, there's always someone who is gonna like what your doing, you might be lucky and it might be someone in a position to do something for ya... no doubt someone in mcd likes halite, doesnt mean i have to
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    shewolf

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    27 Aug 2003 08:49 PM
    i repeat myself at the risk of being crude, better do it quickly though while fishface isn't here, what do you think/feel constitutes star quality? oh i think i hear the sound of flappy fishy fins....
    WickerUser is Offline
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    28 Aug 2003 10:54 AM
    Shewolf has a point. No band has any chance of succeeding if the music is below par, irrespective of the amount of time/effort put into the promotion of it
    fezUser is Offline
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    fez

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    28 Aug 2003 04:16 PM
    They may not ultimately succeed but they will make waves and grace stages at the expense of genuinly better bands. I don't think star-quality can be summed up in a few lines on a message board, there's no secret formula as it were. Star-quality is just something you know a band has(or not) from the minute they walk on stage.I think we have all witnessed star quality at some point, however subjective it may be.It's just that intangible greatness that differentiates one band from the masses.
    mickUser is Offline
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    28 Aug 2003 07:18 PM
    that and good shoes
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    28 Aug 2003 07:52 PM
    now you're talking mick its the little details that seperate them from the masses. there's got to be some hook that says i'm/we're different . some indication or expression that you feel different to most or the same, cos being human is just pretty outlandish in itself, but you ain't scared to go there and express it. little richard wore his eyeliner, jagger his dresses, bowie used to arrive in limos before he made it the list goes on i suppose the last case points to something more essential though. Faith, a knowing that you're something special? certainly even when you feel doubt cos all us do even 'the best' there is a faith in something bigger ..i feel a who song coming on i also think the star quality is inexorably linked to producing good music just look at eh who for example when keith moon died the albums they made henceforth couldn't be given away from the bargain baskets! i think a really good head of hair might also have something to do with it, eno excepted but he's the retiring hide behind his computers anyhow hardly a rock n roll frontman. i suppose i more thinking in terms of that primal thing that frives the boys and girls wild essential if your'e going to make a noise!!?
    fishfaceUser is Offline
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    28 Aug 2003 10:15 PM
    look we are all just kids into sounds you all are blind to the fact of that like it or not most of use are having fun doing what it is doing and maybe some of us will go all the way and good luck to who ever it is so what ever s**t things you have to say on this discussion dont mean s**t to the ones having fun shewolf you only see some of these bands once so i think you should give it a rest till you see them for real but i would like me and you to get it on and make some little fishwolfs and live sinfully ever after.
    shewolfUser is Offline
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    shewolf

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    29 Aug 2003 09:34 AM
    now fishy don't go stale, y'know what'll happen then, you'll start to stink, very unhygenic. no i'm not blind to it at all in fact that's the main thing to me you should be doing it cos you love it its fun regardless of anything else but this discussion has been started up because it is all the muscians themselves who concern themselves with these debates and questions in other sections of the soap box i just thought we might have a little section all of our own to discuss it as it seemed to preoccupy a good deal of the thoughts i've read on this site, Nothing wrong with food for thought but maybe you prefer sucking flakes of superficiality from the surface of your bowl like world rather than diving into the fun of the profound depths of argument, i'll never rest i tell ya and what's real and what's not? If we shadows have offended think but this-and all is mended that you have but slumbered here while these visions did appear and this weak and idle theme no more yielding but a dream i live sinfully anyhow, gota good head of hair?.
    fezUser is Offline
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    29 Aug 2003 10:11 AM
    Fishwolfs.....hmmm...must enquire about them in dublin zoo next time I'm there.
    fezUser is Offline
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    29 Aug 2003 10:12 AM
    Fishwolfs....hmmm...must enquire about them in dublin zoo next time I'm there.
    fezUser is Offline
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    29 Aug 2003 10:14 AM
    Fishwolfs......hmmmm....must enquire about them in dublin zoo next time I'm there.
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