"The Urges" Review or PR
Last Post 5/18/2005 5:49 PM by WhoMe. 29 Replies.
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WhoMe
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5/18/2005 5:49 PM
    Was this gig reviewed by the guy who does "the Urges" website, that seems a bit odd.
    WhoMe
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    5/18/2005 6:08 PM
    Taken from Urges Website Gonzo media... This page was designed and created by Gonzo Media. To get in touch you can email daragh at daragh.murray25@mail.dcu.ie Was it a Review or PR
    Daragh
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    5/18/2005 6:10 PM
    aye it was done by me, it was an honest review, the urges website is a paying gig, not a personal involvement. I think i gave an honest opinion of the band/the night, and didnt them praise them overly. Also, i didnt tell the band that i was doing a review, both were kept separate.
    WhoMe
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    5/18/2005 6:15 PM
    hows it going Daragh. Yeah, just a bit strange hearing a review from someone who has a Financial connection with the band. Not saying it wasnt an honest review but just after re reading it again if seems to make even their negative qualities postivie ones. No disrespect to the lads
    Daragh
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    5/18/2005 6:19 PM
    aye i can see that, its fair enough. I do think though that the review was an honest reflection of the night, and would be in a similar tone to others i have written, (such as the opinion piece) i did read it again just there, and it does perhaps give a good shine, but nothing more than i would have gotten myself from the night. I definitely did not write it as PR, but whether you think so is your own call. I dont really know what to say to be honest, never even thought of it like that until now, which is probably very shortsighted of me. but i would never have considered writing it for some ulterior motive,
    WhoMe
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    5/18/2005 6:24 PM
    All is cool Buddy, just seemed a bit odd. When it comes to reviews though, well, its always gonna be hard to bite the hand that feeds you.
    Daragh
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    5/18/2005 6:35 PM
    no your dead right. As i said though, the thought of it being considered as PR, or anything but an honest review, or even me writing it with an ulterior motive, never even crossed my mind. I would apologise though to anyone who thought of it as deceitful, actually quite embarassed now.
    Unicron
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    5/18/2005 7:30 PM
    In Daragh's defence I arranged the pass for him to get into this and I would have thought that were he so entrenched with the band that he'd pull something with the review he could arrange his own pass.
    Pilchard
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    5/18/2005 10:44 PM
    to be honest, i was gonna ignore this but i've been thinking about it all evening. It IS a conflict of interest, pure and simple, and the kind of thing we'd jump up and down about if it happened in some other publication or paper. reviews are supposed to be fair and honest and if someone is working for the band in any capacity, such fairness and honesty goes out the window. the review should be pulled, in my opinion, to preserve editorial integrity. Moderators, any views?
    Daragh
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    5/18/2005 10:45 PM
    i would agree with that.
    Binokular
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    5/18/2005 11:36 PM
    This isn't really one the regular message board moderators can answer or help you with I'm afraid. Most of the day to day moderation of the boards is done by myself and Rev Jules and neither of us edit any of the reviews section (Jules edits the opinion section).
    roadhousemag
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    5/23/2005 10:45 AM
    There's a review of that gig at www.roadhousemag.com for anyone interested... Read the review here: http://roadhousemag.com/home/reviews.php?id=93 dec
    Mully
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    5/23/2005 11:01 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Pilchard
    to be honest, i was gonna ignore this but i've been thinking about it all evening. It IS a conflict of interest, pure and simple, and the kind of thing we'd jump up and down about if it happened in some other publication or paper. reviews are supposed to be fair and honest and if someone is working for the band in any capacity, such fairness and honesty goes out the window. the review should be pulled, in my opinion, to preserve editorial integrity. Moderators, any views?
    If Daragh didnt write it, who would ? When I first started reading this site, there was new articles & reviews being posted on a weekly basis, but in the last year/18mths this has slowed considerably, to the point that the films reviews have been taken off. Cluas.com is just a forum now, sadly a long distance from the award winning site it was 5yrs ago. The mantra still applies, " 1) Spread the word, 2) Drop back regularly as content is updated several times a month, and, 3) Submit something for publication!"
    segru
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    5/23/2005 1:55 PM
    here's another review of the gig: http://www.soundsxp.com/1873.shtml
    roadhousemag
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    5/23/2005 2:45 PM
    "If Daragh didnt write it, who would?" www.roadhousemag.com review section updated on a weekly basis...
    Pilchard
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    5/23/2005 3:08 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by roadhousemag
    "If Daragh didnt write it, who would?" www.roadhousemag.com review section updated on a weekly basis...
    quote:
    Originally posted by roadhousemag
    "If Daragh didnt write it, who would?" www.roadhousemag.com review section updated on a weekly basis...
    there may be some online competition on the way. i've heard from 2 different people now that Muse.ie is coming back with jim carroll back at the helm. the title has been bought back from eircom and will be relaunching over the summer. anyone else heard this? at least the reviews wont be done by band members or hired help.
    Gar
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    5/23/2005 3:15 PM
    Don't lose faith in Cluas just yet
    roadhousemag
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    5/23/2005 5:59 PM
    "there may be some online competition on the way. i've heard from 2 different people now that Muse.ie is coming back with jim carroll back at the helm. the title has been bought back from eircom and will be relaunching over the summer. anyone else heard this? at least the reviews wont be done by band members or hired help." If you are inferring that we use "hired help" or have an alternative motive other than objectively writing about unsigned music you are terribly mistaken. We dont have a hidden agenda, we dont have "mates" in bands and we dont have "favourites" either. The fact is our site is going seven months, we are actively following the unsigned scene since then. Our main contributers and writers of which at present there are 6 regulars; are NOT musicians, nor friends of certain bands. An accountant, an engineer and a sound engineer operate our site. Not a lead guitarist of a band or a band manager or anyone else affiliated in any way with any of the acts reviewed. We update every week with NEW acts from all over Ireland. If you are dissatisfied with the way we write then please feel free to submit a review to us. You obviously have a broad knowledge of whats going on and feel strongly about it. We operate www.roadhousemag.com, NOTHING else, all we were doing was making you aware of the fact that many journalists reviewed The Urges. And why not? They are an exciting young group on the way up. One thing though, you dont know us from Adam so get your facts straight before you start making insinuations about us. Otherwise feel free to take us up on the offer of a review. RHM.
    aidan
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    5/23/2005 6:09 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Mully When I first started reading this site, there was new articles & reviews being posted on a weekly basis, but in the last year/18mths this has slowed considerably 3)Submit something for publication!"
    I think you answered your own question
    Pilchard
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    5/23/2005 6:23 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by roadhousemag
    "there may be some online competition on the way. i've heard from 2 different people now that Muse.ie is coming back with jim carroll back at the helm. the title has been bought back from eircom and will be relaunching over the summer. anyone else heard this? at least the reviews wont be done by band members or hired help." If you are inferring that we use "hired help" or have an alternative motive other than objectively writing about unsigned music you are terribly mistaken. We dont have a hidden agenda, we dont have "mates" in bands and we dont have "favourites" either. The fact is our site is going seven months, we are actively following the unsigned scene since then. Our main contributers and writers of which at present there are 6 regulars; are NOT musicians, nor friends of certain bands. An accountant, an engineer and a sound engineer operate our site. Not a lead guitarist of a band or a band manager or anyone else affiliated in any way with any of the acts reviewed. We update every week with NEW acts from all over Ireland. If you are dissatisfied with the way we write then please feel free to submit a review to us. You obviously have a broad knowledge of whats going on and feel strongly about it. We operate www.roadhousemag.com, NOTHING else, all we were doing was making you aware of the fact that many journalists reviewed The Urges. And why not? They are an exciting young group on the way up. One thing though, you dont know us from Adam so get your facts straight before you start making insinuations about us. Otherwise feel free to take us up on the offer of a review. RHM.
    Hi RHM Yes, I dont know u from Adam - I have never looked at your magazine and I must make amends right away. Talking of making amends, you should actually read what I wrote, I wasnt talking about your magazine - I was talking about THIS website. Not RHM, THIS website. It seems that there is now a huge question mark over the validity of this review hence all this speculation and chat. U, as far as I can see, jumped in with a plug for your website. I, as far as I can see, made a comment about competition, U, obviously, got the wrong end of the stick and though I was slighting ur magazine. I am happy to say I was not doing this and I hope u will be just as happy to say u jumped to the wrong conclusion Awaiting your speedy retraction/reply/tumble from the high moral ground p
    eoinfilter
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    5/23/2005 9:19 PM
    i havent heard anything bout this, is this the jim carroll who writes for the irish times cause if it is id fully endorse it, hes very critical but very honest, love reading his columns...
    roadhousemag
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    5/23/2005 9:31 PM
    Hey Pilchard fair enough, point taken. We are just protecting our own integrity at any cost, the invitation still stands to submit a review.....
    Una
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    5/23/2005 10:22 PM
    what was/is muse.ie?
    Rev Jules
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    5/23/2005 11:26 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Pilchard
    at least the reviews wont be done by band members or hired help.
    While I won't be drawn into discussions over the actual review in question, I do find the above comment unfair towards Cluas as an entity and its writers as individuals. It suggests that we have a low standard of editorial and final written copy and that is simply not true.
    Pilchard
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    5/24/2005 9:18 AM
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    Originally posted by Rev Jules While I won't be drawn into discussions over the actual review in question, I do find the above comment unfair towards Cluas as an entity and its writers as individuals. It suggests that we have a low standard of editorial and final written copy and that is simply not true.
    I never set out to damn Cluas - I wouldnt be posting here as regularly as I am if I had little regard or respect for it. I think Cluas is a fantastic entity and resource and a fabulous way of finding out about new music (before u then go away and check it out for yourself). However u cannot escape the fact that a review was submitted by someone who had worked with the band and was then published. If this happened on another site or magazine, we would all be crying foul about it. We would be howling about favourtism and bias and questioning the bona fides of the site and the writer. We would climb onto the high moral ground and howl like wolves in heat. A publication rises or falls on its reputation and I'm afraid Cluas has slipped somewhat in my estimation because of this and, judging by the reaction to this thread, I am not alone.
    spurtacus
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    5/24/2005 10:13 AM
    relax te be jaysus the lot o' yis
    eoghan
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    5/24/2005 10:14 AM
    I've just come across this thread after having been absent from the discussion board a while due to some distraction on other fronts. First up, it was I who published Darragh’s Urges review to the site. Had I, at the time of publishing it, known he had done their website I would have taken the precautionary step of not publishing it. Knowing it now I will remove the review from the website tonight. I do think it was an error of judgement – something we are all occasionally guilty of - that Darragh forgot to declare to me his involvement with the band’s website. However I’d like to take the opportunity to make it absolutely clear that: 1) I believe Darragh presented this review in good faith and I don’t think he was trying to pull a fast one. Some may consider me naïve but I believe he genuinely forgot to mention his work on the Urges website to me; 2) I think it is a balanced, well-written review (and a shining light of balanced reviewing compared to some reviews that have come this way, such as this classic one from a few months back: http://www.cluas.com/discussion/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3998 ) 3) I appreciate the immediate - and completely transparent manner - with which Darragh discussed this issue once it was initially raised by ‘WhoMe’ 4) I have always appreciated Darragh’s writing for CLUAS and I look forward to many more submissions from him in the future. On a more general note, I have always considered (and will always consider) the integrity and credibility of what is published on CLUAS a number 1 priority. We won’t always get it 100%, so expect (and allow us) the occasional unintended and minor slip-up. All I promise is that when any slip up does happen, it will be rectified ASAP. eoghan PS – as for those who pointed out that they thought the frequency of updates of reviews on the site is less then they would like, I couldn’t agree more. The last while the site has not been updated by me as often as I would have liked but there has been good reason for that. The coming weeks will see more frequent updates as I get back into the groove. I have a pile of reviews to get through. And an OpEd as well to get on the site. Cheers for the patience. And if anybody is complaining about the frequency of updates to the site I propose they put their time into submitting a review and helping the site on that front.
    Pilchard
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    5/24/2005 10:46 AM
    fair play eoghan - u have put your hand up and said it like it is on this one without fudging any of the issues involved. p
    Mully
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    5/24/2005 11:05 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by aidan
    quote:
    Originally posted by Mully When I first started reading this site, there was new articles & reviews being posted on a weekly basis, but in the last year/18mths this has slowed considerably 3)Submit something for publication!"
    I think you answered your own question
    Yeah, I was waiting for that. Not sure what my old english teacher would say.
    aidan
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    5/24/2005 11:08 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by eoghan
    such as this classic one from a few months back: http://www.cluas.com/discussion/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3998 )
    I had forgotten how priceless that one was ('like a poem in a deep lake') - thanks for that, captain the site could have a special section for these types of reviews (names deleted, of course), like our little 'poet's corner' - and maybe then we could even vote for the best one and send it to the "eurovision song-reviewing contest" to compete against supermodel-looking eastern european reviews.. okay, enough of that, back to work


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