WhoMe Basic Member Posts:191  
| 11/24/2005 11:42 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by jaypers
They are breath of fresh air for Ireland then. Sorry i only said Dublin but its the only place in Ireland where i getv to see live music.
Alright, just imagine the scenario. You hear a New band From Kerry and you think they sound unoriginal. your mate says "Wha, they sound like no other band in kerry" Does this have any relevance to your original opinion.
But your right, they arent the most original band in the world and i as a Dublin gig goer too couldnt name you another band that plays dublin regulary that sound like them. I really enjoy their gigs
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Sniffee New Member Posts:28
| 11/24/2005 11:46 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Dromed
quote:
Originally posted by WhoMe
quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
Humanzi are good but not original. Plus they have a good manager.
agreed, they are fun to watch but need a bit of originality and their own identity. I always think of them as a manufactured boyband for some reason, like McFly :-) I know this isnt the case in reality though, just get that vibe off them. I would jump around at their gigs but their recordings and songs arent really that strong, Still great to see them making a name for themselves.
Hopefully Channel 1 will be up for one next year
THey've released one single! I think every song they've got is a potential single and really strong. I hardly think you can put them in the same category as McFly! And since when is having a good manager a crime?
I wasn't dissing Humanzi when I pointed out Alan Cullivan's involvement - far from it: more power to their L-bows, say I. I'm just gently suggesting that this, more than any intrinsic musical criteria, explains why it's them we're talking about in the first place and not any other potential contender. In other words, whether we like it or not, our terms of reference are being shaped to a certain extent before we even begin by industry tastemakers. Ditto Delorentos in that they've spent several years working their behinds off without anyone making the least brouhaha about them until very very recently - the reason?: sudden quantum leap in songwriting quality? Nope... the tastemakers have finally taken them under their wing, simple as that. Once again, I'm at pains to stress, we should wish them and everyone else in the current batch the best of luck - they may not be a particulary original or unique band, but they damn well deserve some eventual success for their professionalism and drive. But for goodness sake don't fall for the 'sudden spontaneous groundswell' illusion - it's neither sudden, spontaneous nor a bottom-up groundswell. The buzz of their recent Whelans gig was created 'before' the first note was played. I could go on with examples - Paddy Casey busking on Grafton St before he was picked up by Principal Management, Republic of Loose being managed by Dermot Doran, etc etc. There's nothing corrupt about any of this, but there is an element of optical illusion to the way an act 'breaks'. This is sociology not musicology. I'm not a cynic or a conspiracy theorist, I'm just saying that the process is every bit as clinical in its own way as the filtering process on Pop Idol or You're A Star. The difference here is that it's (a bit) more subtle. |
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WhoMeBasic Member Posts:191
| 11/24/2005 11:50 AM |
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"I'm not a cynic or a conspiracy theorist", yeah right buddy, i can read between the lines Your trying to say Humanzi shot kennedy arent ya
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SniffeeNew Member Posts:28
| 11/24/2005 11:53 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by WhoMe
"I'm not a cynic or a conspiracy theorist", yeah right buddy, i can read between the lines Your trying to say Humanzi shot kennedy arent ya
Only Robert |
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Unicron Veteran Member Posts:1696
| 11/24/2005 2:15 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
Ditto Delorentos in that they've spent several years working their behinds off without anyone making the least brouhaha about them until very very recently - the reason?: sudden quantum leap in songwriting quality? Nope...
On the other hand Kieran told me himself a few months ago after one of their gigs that up until the last 18 months or so they were "s**te", and a lot of their older songs have been jettisoned recently too. |
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SniffeeNew Member Posts:28
| 11/24/2005 2:49 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Unicron
quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
Ditto Delorentos in that they've spent several years working their behinds off without anyone making the least brouhaha about them until very very recently - the reason?: sudden quantum leap in songwriting quality? Nope...
On the other hand Kieran told me himself a few months ago after one of their gigs that up until the last 18 months or so they were "s**te", and a lot of their older songs have been jettisoned recently too.
Valid point, Unicron - and fair balls to the lads for being self-critical enough to make some improvements. Still, 18 months is hardly sudden...
I guess I'm talking about the amusing scenario we've all seen: an unknown band plays a support appearance in front of an audience that couldn't care less... fast forward a few months and the SAME band is playing the SAME songs and throwing the SAME shapes, only this time their every shimmy goes down a storm. The music is a constant, other variables are in play here. Too many people refuse to give acts a chance unless they've been buzzed up by the media or the scene. Too few acts get buzzed up by the media or the scene unless they've got heavyweight backing of some sort. Doesn't mean no quality ever gets through. I just find the psychology of it all kinda interesting |
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UnaVeteran Member Posts:1721
| 11/24/2005 6:27 PM |
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I like when people say about a rock band "no one else is doing what they're doing"
because, it is ridiculous
and I like ridiculous things
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DamienBasic Member Posts:316
| 11/24/2005 9:39 PM |
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Humanzi play entire gigs on uni-motor-cycles. FACT.
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WhoMeBasic Member Posts:191
| 11/25/2005 9:19 AM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Damien
Humanzi play entire gigs on uni-motor-cycles. FACT.
Its true, althought they disguise these uni-cycles as musical intruments. Quite clever really |
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UnicronVeteran Member Posts:1696
| 11/25/2005 12:11 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
fast forward a few months and the SAME band is playing the SAME songs and throwing the SAME shapes, only this time their every shimmy goes down a storm. The music is a constant, other variables are in play here. Too many people refuse to give acts a chance unless they've been buzzed up by the media or the scene. Too few acts get buzzed up by the media or the scene unless they've got heavyweight backing of some sort.
Well as far as Delorentos go (and I suppose that the point can be extrapolated to include all bands that suddenly get a buzz about them) I think it could be down to hard work on their part as well as your suggestions. They've played a lot of gigs this year, I've seen them 6 or 7 times in the past 12 months and they've never failed to impress me and I'm sure that I wasn't the only one. Surely that's the way it's suposed to work in an ideal world, you play a lot of gigs, are consistantly good and more people come to see you next time around and they drag their mates along; wash, rinse and repeat.
Maybe the media is partly down to it too but not hugely, on Cluas's part we've written positive things about them in my 66e review ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/66e.htm) Gar's Live and Clear Review ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/loud_clear.htm) my review of their Crawdaddy gig ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos.htm), Daragh's HWCH ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos2.htm) and Whelan's ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos3.htm) reviews and in various gig of the fortnight's, I'd wager that we've championed them more than any other publication, online or print, in the past 12 months (about the only other mention that I can recall is John Meaghar lumping them in the "not crap" category in THAT indo piece) but I'd never argue that we were in any way responsible for 506 people showing up to see them in Whelans, they're a good band and people are recognising that fact.
As to why they've seen an upsurge in their popularity in the last 12 months and getting coverage, well I can only speak for myself but the reason I never liked them before or wrote a word about them before January was that I'd never seen them before that. Even if it's someone's fulltime job to write about music unlike the hobbyists here you can't be expected to know every band that's on the scene. |
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| 11/25/2005 12:39 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
Ditto Delorentos in that they've spent several years working their behinds off without anyone making the least brouhaha about them until very very recently - the reason?: sudden quantum leap in songwriting quality? Nope... the tastemakers have finally taken them under their wing, simple as that.
Hmm....not entirely true. And not entirely fair I think...
I hold my hand up as a major fan of the band. But I feel they HAVE improved considerably over the psat couple of years. As long as I've known them and have heard their music, (about 3 years) (and they'd been around for about 3 years prior to that too) it's never been s**te, by any means. The songwriting talent and the musical talent was always there. But their seemingly recent success can be attributed far more to their own hard HARD work, personal development, commitment, good choices, personal integrity, orgainsation ... and not forgetting a small line-up change around 2 years ago which added another songwriting angle to the package. If you've seen them live, you'll know the last point is hugely significant.
I think it's unfair to presume that the tastemakers are entirely in control of making or breaking every band, and that it just comes down to a simple flight of fancy each time. Of course this CAN happen from time to time, but I'm saying it's not a given. It completely diminishes the band's own efforts which is crazy, or at least it is in this instance.
In Delorentos' case, I have absolutely NO doubt that their success to date has been about 90pc influenced by the factors above, and maybe 10pc aided by luck, and a trend that's been happening of late. I think you can allow them have that 10pc.  I've often heard people say "the harder you work, the luckier you become", and that's definitely the case here, or at least I really hope it does prove to be the case in the long run. |
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loserbrianNew Member Posts:46
| 11/25/2005 1:36 PM |
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I think they are managed by same guys as Directors who got signed recently. Good managment always gets you more media attention cause they have the contacts. I think delerentos are great but getting On dave fanning for an independent record release doesnt just happen cause your great. That stuff takes contacts. Just like the meteors is about contacts.....
You appear on Fanning, the indo, some guy on a website says your good then the herd abandons their preconseption that your s**t cause your unsigned and takes you seriously cause if you were on fanning then that means you must be good. Thats a reflection of peoples attitudes to unsigned bands not a pop at the delorentos who i think are great.
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Pilchard Advanced Member Posts:699
| 11/25/2005 2:07 PM |
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delorentos are managed/looked after by Hugh Murray (ex-A&R at Sony Music Ireland and UK) but that only has a small bit to do with it. The band have just improved hugely and thus, people are paying attention. they won the national student music awards in ireland and then went and won the UK one as well - a lot of cynical judges would have seen them at that and they came out trumps.
of course, who manages you and does your PR and releases your records has a lot to do with your success but if the songs aint there, no amount of management and PR and record labels will put that right, Humanzi may get loads of headlines in 2006, but they'll be well forgotten by 2016. as will, unfortunately, most of todays contenders, next big things and wannabes
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loserbrianNew Member Posts:46
| 11/25/2005 4:36 PM |
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Only has a small bit to do with my ass. Yes they are good and do deserve all they get as i have said allready. The question raised in the thread is why the sudden rise in popularity. You say its mainly because of their new tunes I say its because of the great work the managment are doing. To say you cant get anywhere without songs to back up the hype is absolute bulls**t I could post a list that goes on for pages of bands who ride on hype.
In this case Delorentos do have the tunes but so do many bands i have heard and the difference between them and the delorentos is managment.
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SteeplejackNew Member Posts:17
| 11/25/2005 7:21 PM |
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I definitely agree with Loserbrian on the management thing. As I mentioned in another thread PUGWASH have suffered from bad management in the past but with 1969 Records on board now things are starting to change for them. 1969 are definitely still an indie label but by the sounds of one of it's main men (who has posted on the board elsewhere)they will do all they can to pump more money into bands like PUGWASH because they know they have too, to keep up with the various management companies mentioned above.
The Delorentos are big PUGWASH fans by the way. 
SJ |
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| 11/26/2005 12:33 PM |
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I definitely agree that good management has a lot to do with it, but as far as I'm aware delorentos were self-managed up until quite recently. They won the irish and uk NSMA earlier this year on their own steam.
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SniffeeNew Member Posts:28
| 11/26/2005 3:17 PM |
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quote:
Originally posted by Unicron
quote:
Originally posted by Sniffee
fast forward a few months and the SAME band is playing the SAME songs and throwing the SAME shapes, only this time their every shimmy goes down a storm. The music is a constant, other variables are in play here. Too many people refuse to give acts a chance unless they've been buzzed up by the media or the scene. Too few acts get buzzed up by the media or the scene unless they've got heavyweight backing of some sort.
Well as far as Delorentos go (and I suppose that the point can be extrapolated to include all bands that suddenly get a buzz about them) I think it could be down to hard work on their part as well as your suggestions. They've played a lot of gigs this year, I've seen them 6 or 7 times in the past 12 months and they've never failed to impress me and I'm sure that I wasn't the only one. Surely that's the way it's suposed to work in an ideal world, you play a lot of gigs, are consistantly good and more people come to see you next time around and they drag their mates along; wash, rinse and repeat.
Maybe the media is partly down to it too but not hugely, on Cluas's part we've written positive things about them in my 66e review (http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/66e.htm) Gar's Live and Clear Review (http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/loud_clear.htm) my review of their Crawdaddy gig (http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos.htm), Daragh's HWCH (http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos2.htm) and Whelan's (http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos3.htm) reviews and in various gig of the fortnight's, I'd wager that we've championed them more than any other publication, online or print, in the past 12 months (about the only other mention that I can recall is John Meaghar lumping them in the "not crap" category in THAT indo piece) but I'd never argue that we were in any way responsible for 506 people showing up to see them in Whelans, they're a good band and people are recognising that fact.
As to why they've seen an upsurge in their popularity in the last 12 months and getting coverage, well I can only speak for myself but the reason I never liked them before or wrote a word about them before January was that I'd never seen them before that. Even if it's someone's fulltime job to write about music unlike the hobbyists here you can't be expected to know every band that's on the scene.
We're probably not that much in disagreement, Unicron. But, for the heck of it, let's take your list of reviews.
In the first ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/66e.htm), Delorentos are described in a mere line-and-a-half as an efficient alt-rock outfit, the best of a pretty miserable night's lot.
In the second ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/loud_clear.htm), we're told that they're going "from strength to strength" - tho evidently not enough to threaten Jove's supremacy or even, for that matter, merit a mention in the review line-up headline.
In the third ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos.htm), we're told of their ability to draw a "very respectable" crowd.
In the fourth ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos2.htm), they show just enough "potential" to be graciously awarded 7/10, while
in the fifth ( http://www.cluas.com/music/gigs/delorentos3.htm), potential has magically turned into epoch-making actuality: 9/10!, "amazing"! - "from a purely scientific point of view"!
Now here's my query: what role in this rising curve of critical and public enthusiasm did music have to play - compared to the role, say, of, oh I don't know, various tastemakers (such as Student Awards judges, HWCH organisers - Olympia, anyone?, management, press)? Follow-up question: how many of the 506 people who came to the Whelans gig would you say already knew their music or their live performance first-hand? Why did they all creep out of the woodwork so suddenly? Most important question: how would you compare the band you saw in your first review in January to the band that played Whelans? If they were in any way comparable in quality, I would have thought that the band which took to the stage in Whelans to support 66e were already so mind-blowingly special as to merit more than a measly 30-odd words of text. Hardly "I've seen the future, and his name is Bruce Springsteen" or Bill Graham's U2 epiphany, is it?
Once again, I stress my interest here is not in the band themselves but in the sheep who need to be told who they like before going to the awful bother of liking them. |
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| 11/26/2005 4:20 PM |
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tis an interesting debate,a kind of chicken and egg story !!word of mouth probably had a part to play , maybe the tastemakers listened too what fans were saying and finally went along to check out a gig themselfs , found them to be a talented,entertaining ,terrific live ,then decided to share the fans opinion in print .....whatcha think. Takes a lot of pressure to brake surface tension ,the change appears instant while the hard work was a constant !! Cream always rises to surface its a scientific fact .
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| 11/26/2005 4:33 PM |
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Snifee, I can appreciate what you're saying - genuinely. But does it really have to be as sinister as you seem to be making out? It is not fairly logical that a band that are good will find themselves with an increasingly loyal following on the back of a series of good gigs?
Band plays well, audience go home thinking "hrm, they're pretty good".
Band annoucnes next date. Previous audience members think "hey, I'm gonna go to that and I'm going to recommend to my friend that they go too coz I think they'll really like them". Band plays well. New recruits think "hey, they ARE good, I'm really glad I went to see them". And so it continues exponentially.
Is it not possible that the magic 506 who squished into Whelans recently to see them might have been an amalgamation of audiences from previous gigs? Could it be that word of the band's talent had spread and that the 506 people contained a lot of people who had never seen them before but had come along out of curiosity to check them out? Maybe it was made up partly of people who heard the band's single every night for a week on Pet Sounds a few months earlier and who felt they'd like to hear more.
I think this is all perfectly natural and I don't think a band should necessarily be made to feel that they're being overhyped and that their rising popularity is being controlled by the rather disingenuous factors that you're referring to.
I'm all for a nice bit of cynicism when it's called-for, , but I don't really think your cynicism is necessarily well-placed with regard to Delorentos.
But as I said, I'm not having a go at your argument - I think it's highly valid in its own way, but just not in this instance.
But sure, live and let live. |
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| 11/26/2005 4:37 PM |
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And what Aurora said about management is right - they were self-managed until quite recently so it would be unfair to imply that they were "rescued" by a slick manager with a little black book. They got to where they are thanks to their own hard graft and savvy, so, y'know, credit where it's due.
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