The most over-rated bands of all time - CLUAS Irish Indie Music -

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Last Post 9/4/2007 10:12 AM by Sebastian Dangerfield

The most over-rated bands of all time

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Pilchard

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Posts:699

8/9/2005 9:27 AM
What bands do people reckon are completely over-rated? By which I mean completely unworthy of all the lavish attention and respectful focus they receive. I'm not talking about the usual pop suspects but those acts which are supposed to be the be all and end all for rock/indie fans. I'll start the ball rolling with The Smiths. Truly the greatest musical travesty ever foisted on the world. One or two decent songs and nothing else. You rarely ever read or hear anyone examining the band and their output without rosetinted glasses. Leave aside the whole "first great indie band" nonsense and you're left with a load of terrible music Let the barbs begin

benni

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Posts:947

8/9/2005 9:54 AM
ok I'll whole heartedly disagree with that! I have a few nominations - one would def be Manic Street Preachers. Absolute s**t. Apart from one or two good tunes in their early years I never got why they were so often lauded as one of the seminal bands of the past few years.

klootfan

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Posts:851

8/9/2005 10:08 AM
Couldnt agree with the smiths as being over rated. It might take a while to get into them, but they aint half bad at all... In my own humble opinion, Oasis are highly over rated, I think they are largely successful due to the antics of the gallagher brothers and the scene at the time. people liked seeing liam strutting around like a muppet.being the big rock star..and i think that Pete Doherty is attracting attention for the same reason

Dromed

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Posts:900

8/9/2005 10:46 AM
Defo agree with you there Kloot - Oasis are wayyyyy over-rated. A couple of good tunes does not a rock giant make. The title of lyrical genius bestowed on Noel Gallagher from some camps is plain ridiculous. Morrissey/The Smiths on the other hand know how to pen a tune. I'm not in to sentimentalising that band - but regrdless of context The Smiths had some amazing tunes, great riffs and Morrisseys noir observations. A brilliant lyricist, even if he can be a sour faced fop. Currently think Bloc Party are the most over rated band going. Terrible, terrible lyrics.

John Doe

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Posts:338

8/9/2005 11:21 AM
Joy Division. I just never got the appeal. Tedious, droning depression music. Cue pitchforks and burning torches as hordes of outraged Cluas readers descend on John Doe's home

benni

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Posts:947

8/9/2005 11:31 AM
quote: Originally posted by John Doe Cue pitchforks and burning torches as hordes of outraged Cluas readers descend on John Doe's home And I am leading the argry mob John Doe.... if that IS your real name. I think the reason people may think that is because now a days every single band seems to be name checking Joy Division and every journalist seems to think that every good drummer or bassist is akin to the style of J Div. Its like the band in themselves have become a buzz word as much as.... 'angular' this and 'angular' that. I guess the influence is there but a few years back the mention of Joy Division or say Bauhaus usually got blank faces as a reaction.

Mully

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Posts:849

8/9/2005 11:44 AM
quote: Originally posted by John Doe I just never got the appeal. Maybe this is the direction that the thread should be taken ... "I'm sure they are very good, but I just dont get them" Smiths get my vote ... sorry.

benni

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Posts:947

8/9/2005 12:09 PM
Oh yea totally I was just taking the piss with that mob comment obviously. I just think thats why there is a bit of a Joy D backlash going on now so many years later. They seem to be having more success now than they did in 81! One band that gets my semi vote is (and I'm gonna get slated for this I know) is... The Beatles. Dont get me wrong I know they are great obviously but the work that gets the most praise is the latter years whereas in my opinion the earlier Rock n Roll -Ticket to Ride era stuff is mainly where its at for me. Ok... you can all attack now.

Eric

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Posts:179

8/9/2005 1:09 PM
Shame on you for suggesting the Beatles are overrated! I couldn't agree more with Joy Division/Ian Curtis being over rated, I have given their music a chance and really can't see the 'genius' that people talk about. The big one for me is Enemem. I cannot understand how people worship this guy. Granted there are one are two numbers with heart felt lyrics and a catchy bass lines. But overall its crap, comically bad music that you expect to her from a 15 year old with a casio player. 'Would the real slim shady please stand up please stand up please stand up'

palace

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Posts:392

8/9/2005 1:10 PM
don't agree with the beatles or the smiths...ceratinly don't agree with joy division but i didn't realise there was a backlash against them? - they've always been well followed and referenced, nothing's changed there i don't think... they should really be taken as a whole with early new order as well - massively influential ...do agree with the manic street preachers - bland, bland music - it's the lyrics that appear to attract many - not me however... can't really think of any of my own... never really got blur... not 100% sure about talking heads either - their star has grown over the years

benni

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Posts:947

8/9/2005 1:35 PM
Noooo see what I mean is I think the Beatles later stuff is overrated comparitively to the earlier stuff which is never really given a look in. I am well aware of their massive influence and contribution to music. Re: Joy Division there isnt really a back lash as such but lately with sooooooo many bands and articles name checking them they have become much more commercially exposed and therefore their 'genius' or whatever is being examined a lot more - are they worthy of all of this influential praise they are recieving of late? etc (which in my opinion they most certainly are) So there ya go.

stroller

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Posts:576

8/9/2005 3:37 PM
Damien Dempsey - People go on like he's the new Christy Moore but he's more like the new Richie Kavanagh. He's got a voice which is more suited for selling sports socks on Moore Street than it is for singing. He's penned some of the most clichéd, juvenile cringe inducing lyrics I've ever heard. And the music is just bollcks. Pearl Jam - I don't see any difference between them and Nickleback. Bland, unimaginative, lowest common denominator American rawk in it's worst form. Pink Floyd - How is it that every dodgy 70's prog rock band from Genesis to Emerson, Lake & Palmer get the piss ripped out of them but these boring self indulgent bstards get away scot free? Metallica/System of a Down/Dozens of other "credible" metal bands - Nonsense for Retards. Idelwild - They're just the new Travis aren't they? Paddy Casey/Mundy - Two of the worst songwriters I've ever had the misfortune to hear. Muse/Chilli Peppers/Foo Fighters/Killers - They all have a couple of alright tunes but not enough to justify their reputations. Green Day - What's supposed to be the difference between these fellas and the Offspring? Guns N Roses - A more colourful Bon Jovi. Nothing more. U2 - haven't done anything decent since the 90's. The Smiths, The Beatles, Talking Heads, Bloc Party and Joy Division are all class. While they might have done some good stuff at the start of their careers Eminem, Oasis and the Manics have been churning out sh*t for years. Blur's back catalogue is patchy but they've released a lot of great tunes over the years. Oh and while they do have their moments Sonic Youth and the Who are over rated too.

Eric

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8/9/2005 4:00 PM
Good man Stroller! That gave me a good laugh, never one to sit on the fence! Not that I agree with any of your sugggestions.

Binokular

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Posts:1665

8/9/2005 4:41 PM
Joy Division are an incredibly depressing band, they are extremely harsh to listen to and if it wasn't for "Love Will Tear Us Apart" I doubt they would have ever really registered on the mainstream conciousness. I like Joy Division, they're one of my favourite bands, but at the same time its easy to see why some people don't like them. Their music is a bit stark and minimal isn't it? I generally prefer to listen to New Order over Joy Division. Now Joy Division have spawned a load of imitators and people who've been influenced by them recently, just like they did the first time round, but you can't really hold them responsible for that can you? It'd be like holding The Stooges responsible for The Hives. Beatles - Over/Under-rated? I dunno, I think John Lennon kind of put his finger on the problem with the infamous "bigger than Jesus" (mis)quote, the Beatles are so big that no one really has a sense of perspective on them. The Beatles are good but not that good is my personal view. Can't agree about Sonic Youth, a modern and superior Velvet Underground in my opinion, but then I like almost everything these guys do, except maybe the more extreme moments of experimentation/avant-garde posturing. Metallica - hard to say, lead singers a muppet, last album was crap, but Enter Sandman rocks! The Manics actually showed promise on a couple of early singles and I like "motorcycle emptiness" ( I think thats what its called), but other than that mostly yawn-inducing. Smiths - never into them myself, but definitely a couple of good tunes, and Johnny Marr deserves serious respect as a guitarist. Eminem - couldn't agree more, this guys 15 minutes of Jerry Springer-esque fame are up! NEXT!

Daragh

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Posts:666

8/9/2005 5:46 PM
I think Pink Floyd are pretty good, who gives a f**k about all their ego fuelled excess, they have made some quality albums. Dark Side of The Moon, Piper at The Gates of Dawn, and Wish You Were Here, are three really, really good albums. I also think that they made a joke out of every other performance at live8, (that i saw anyway). I dont really see the attraction of a lot of new bands like Razorlight, Kasabian, and Bloc Party though, they're alright, but not really that great at all.

Binokular

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Posts:1665

8/9/2005 6:21 PM
In defense of The Who - patch, often poorly recorded albums, but great moments that make it all worthwhile. If any heavy rock band from that era is overrated, I'd say its Led Zeppelin - revered by rock fans, yet just nowhere near as good as the Who, Hendrix and even Cream.

curling is great

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8/9/2005 7:21 PM
I think James Blunt is over-rated

stroller

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Posts:576

8/9/2005 7:58 PM
quote: Originally posted by curling is great I think James Blunt is over-rated Who the f*ck rates James Blunt?

Unicron

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8/9/2005 8:53 PM
Anything connected to Pete Doherty. Kaiser Cheifs Franz Ferdinand THE STONE f**kING ROSES Happy Mondays

benni

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Posts:947

8/10/2005 8:40 AM
quote: Originally posted by Binokular If any heavy rock band from that era is overrated, I'd say its Led Zeppelin Oh my God yes. Thank you. Everytime I say that to my Zepplin obsessed mates they throw a wobbler but seriously I dont get why they are supposed to be soooooooooooo good. So much pretentious guitar w**king seriously... and before someone jumps on me there is a huge difference between their guitar masturbation and what Hendrix did.

sweetie

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Posts:132

8/10/2005 9:04 AM
I think the manic's 'holy bible' is a mid-nineties classic but most of the rest is poor. I believe ryan adams to be way overrated and just a decent but prolific songwriter. The beach boys and love are other groups that I've tried listening to their supposed classic albums and most of it doesn't do it for me.

Daragh

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Posts:666

8/10/2005 9:13 AM
aye led zep are guilty of a lot of wkin, 'specially the most boring drum solo in the world that is "Moby dk" (killer riff though) hate the mad bits in Dazed and Confused though, that said they do have some class tunes, really love their acoustic stuff, 'specially Tangerine and Bron y aur stomp sweetie - did you listen to "Forever Changes" by Love? really love that album, took some people i know a while to get into it, but they love it now too. I think The White Stripes are hugely over rated too, well over rated is probably the wrong word, 'cos i think theyre a good band, but i really don't know how they got to the festival head line level,

off the post

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8/10/2005 9:37 AM
What about the Rolling Stones? I know they had a few good tunes and I use the past tense cause when was the last time they had a seriously good one? I just don't think they deserve the praise, attention and name dropping they get. And all this cultural revolution stuff, b****x to that.

Dromed

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Posts:900

8/10/2005 9:40 AM
Pink Floyd are one of the truly innovative bands - they pushed boundaries - albeit sometimes they went a little too far :) but you can't watch Dave Gilmour and not be impressed - the bastard makes it look so easy!! They wiped the floor at Live 8 having not played in so long, they put everyone else to shame. Don't want to turn this thread into another Frames-hating episode but I just don't get how they can be so popular. I think the whole singer-songwriter movement is way over rated. If introspection, melancholy and self-analysis (i.e. public purging) is an indication of talent then every 14 year old in the country that knows 3 chords is a genius.

Mully

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Posts:849

8/10/2005 9:52 AM
quote: Originally posted by Daragh I think The White Stripes are hugely over rated too, well over rated is probably the wrong word, 'cos i think theyre a good band, but i really don't know how they got to the festival head line level, And it goes a little something like this ... G¦-------------------------------------------------------------------------¦ D¦-------------------------------------------------------------------------¦ A¦-------------------------------------------------------------------------¦ E¦----5-5-8-5-3-1-0-5-5-8-5-3-1-0-5-5-8-5-3-1-0-5-5-8-5-3-8-10-8-7---------¦

Norman Schwarzkopf

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8/10/2005 10:53 AM
I'm not THAT well informed but a lot of what I've heard outta Bruce Springsteen doesn't tell me why he's so revered in certain circles. He get's my vote.

Daragh

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Posts:666

8/10/2005 11:45 AM
aye seven nation army and fell in love with a girl we're pretty huge tunes, but...

Norman Schwarzkopf

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8/10/2005 12:03 PM
They're also a fantastic live band and fascinating to watch. They've managed to become commercially and critically popular with strong albums and all you gotta do is look at the crowd who saw em at Glastonbury to determine whether theyre a headline draw or not.

benni

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Posts:947

8/10/2005 12:03 PM
quote: Originally posted by Daragh I think The White Stripes are hugely over rated too, well over rated is probably the wrong word, 'cos i think theyre a good band, but i really don't know how they got to the festival head line level, Regardles tho I'd still prefer to see them at the top of a slot than Greenday, Foo Fighters or........ Bjorn A-f**king-gain!

off the post

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Posts:284

8/10/2005 12:09 PM
quote: Originally posted by benni quote: Originally posted by Daragh I think The White Stripes are hugely over rated too, well over rated is probably the wrong word, 'cos i think theyre a good band, but i really don't know how they got to the festival head line level, Regardles tho I'd still prefer to see them at the top of a slot than Greenday, Foo Fighters or........ Bjorn A-f**king-gain! Yep, too true . Especialy hate those fkrs Greenday....

Daragh

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Posts:666

8/10/2005 12:13 PM
i know i couldn't agree more, i like the band, and would love to see 'em live. It just surprises me thats all.

Pilchard

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Posts:699

8/10/2005 1:39 PM
interesting names popping up here and interesting definitions of over-rated too. didnt expect to see some of them (who the f**k has any time for James Blunt?) and expected to see some more sacred cows, still, early days besides the smiths, i also think Radiohead are astonishingly over-rated. one decent album ("Kid A") and loads of turgid middleclass moaning and groaning. <pilchard steps well back and dons crash helmet>

off the post

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8/10/2005 1:45 PM
quote: Originally posted by Pilchard interesting names popping up here and interesting definitions of over-rated too. didnt expect to see some of them (who the f**k has any time for James Blunt?) and expected to see some more sacred cows, still, early days besides the smiths, i also think Radiohead are astonishingly over-rated. one decent album ("Kid A") and loads of turgid middleclass moaning and groaning. <pilchard steps well back and dons crash helmet> Kinda agree, never got my head around all the Radiohead hype. Can't agree about the Smiths though. What about the Fugees? Killing me Softly used to just kill me full stop.

benni

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Posts:947

8/10/2005 1:54 PM
Oh yea and The Counting Crows and all that kind of milarky.... hoards upon hoards praising them to the max. s**tE!!!

Unicron

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Posts:1696

8/10/2005 1:54 PM
quote: Originally posted by Pilchard besides the smiths, i also think Radiohead are astonishingly over-rated. one decent album ("Kid A") and loads of turgid middleclass moaning and groaning. <pilchard steps well back and dons crash helmet> DIE, you die now. <bypasses the crash helmit by stabbing Pilchard in the chest

Mully

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Posts:849

8/10/2005 2:18 PM
quote: Originally posted by Pilchard (who the f**k has any time for James Blunt?) I got a lift home from my sister yesterday ... 8 James Blunt songs in a row. Oh dear God, it had me praying to switch over to Tony Fentons dulsid tones ...

Norman Schwarzkopf

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8/10/2005 2:19 PM
Bizarre. To select Kid A as their one decent album! OK Computer says: Does not compute.

Daragh

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Posts:666

8/10/2005 2:32 PM
oh what about the Dave Matthews band, and Phish, both huge in the states, and neither of them are really that good. Phish are kinda stepping into the void left by the Dead, but whats Matthew's excuse?

Pilchard

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Posts:699

8/11/2005 1:43 PM
quote: Originally posted by Norman Schwarzkopf Bizarre. To select Kid A as their one decent album! OK Computer says: Does not compute. Kid A is fantastic, norman. Everything that Radiohead allegedly are: Exciting Different Challenging Interesting Colourful Loud Out-there By comparison, "OK Computer" sounds like Snow Patrol's leftovers <Pilchard goes looking for a bigger crash helmet>

Norman Schwarzkopf

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Posts:427

8/11/2005 2:16 PM
Whhhhhaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!! I'll pull that crash helmet out your arse! ;) Don't get me wrong, I love Kid A to bits. But to single it out as their one decent album form the 6 is just crazy talk! Regardless of Kid A's existence, OK Computer is a stunning piece of work! The day Snow Patrol write something even 1/10 as good as Paranoid Android, is the day pigs fly through a wintry hell with Daphne & Celeste's latest triple disc freeform jazz opus playing on their vinyl compatible walkmen.

mickeyjoe

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8/11/2005 3:07 PM
One of the most overrated bands in recent years is Franz Ferdinand in my opinion, i just think they have been hyped beyond all comprehension.

benni

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Posts:947

8/11/2005 3:41 PM
Nah Franz Ferdinand are good at what they do - I dont think they've ever been lauded as genius (well apart from that award from NME as 'the band most likley to change your life' in 2003... but then was the NME) I dont think they claim or are hyped to be anything but creators of some good pop songs. Overplayed is probably a more adept title than overrated.

vandala

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8/12/2005 2:56 PM
Heresy, I'm sure, but I could never figure out why people made such a big deal over Nirvana. Adequate, competent, but in my book, undeserved.

mcgyver

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Posts:29

8/12/2005 3:33 PM
I hear ya,never understood the level of praise lavished on them ,not to say Im not into a fair bit of their stuff but I think there's alot of revisionist nonsense mentioned in regard them and their "legacy".... Im sure its popped up in this thread already but Pete Doherty.. don't get me started..

curling is great

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8/14/2005 3:47 PM
I think Daphne & Cleste are quite good actually... at what they do

palace

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8/15/2005 10:27 AM
with regards to nirvana, if you weren't there at the time, you'll have no idea what a giant kick in the arse smells like teen spirit was to mainstream music when it first appeared... ...that said, grunge in general was a bit rubbish and nirvana hardly hold up as one of the best bands the world has ever seen so the revisionist theory wouldn't be far off the mark

Vent My Spleen

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Posts:500

8/15/2005 1:42 PM
Er...ummm..I was "there" at the time of Teen Spirit and still don't unserstand how it is regarded as some sort of musical crossing of the rubicon. Don't get me wrong, Nirvana were a good band and I had some of their stuff prior to Teen Spirit breaking but there were dozens of bands with similar and often better offerings at the time. I'll put on my flame proof trousers now. Nirvana were the first "alternative" (for want of a better word) to crossover to playlists on MTV and were literally catepulted into the conciousness of a generation tortured by years of Kylie, Bros and Wacko Jacko on the box. Personally I think they were more important in terms of a great many people discovering music outside of the mainstream that perhaps their actual music justified. A bit of a Zeitgeist.

palace

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8/15/2005 3:16 PM
yeah, it was more the crossing over to the mainstream consciousness... it did have quite a big effect on the average joe on the street... ...don't think i've even listened to a nirvana record in about 8 years so i'd be inclined to go with the overrated thing

clare

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8/15/2005 3:41 PM
beatles are clearly over-rated, plus they spawned wings. oasis = sub beatles and are w**k.

Daragh

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8/15/2005 3:53 PM
how are the beatles clearly over rated? They have a tonne of really great tunes, they may not be the "best band ever" but they are damn good. I don't listen to them much myself any more, mainly cos my taste has shifted a little, but they were huge in getting me into music (and a hell of a lot of other people) and they definitely opened the door for a lot more artists to create. Just because the beatles were a big influence on oasis doesnt mean they should be written off, by that logic dylan should be shot for bringing the singer songwriter into the mainstream, or jimmy page for fret w**king. Actually listenend to sgt peppers straight through in a friends house the other night, really great record.

Antistar

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8/15/2005 3:55 PM
Faithless! What's the f**king deal with them? Crappy,simplistic, supposedly 'really uplifting, maan' 2-note synth pop overlaid with that geezer's rambling, 'we are one' cod-philosophising. Tripe.

palace

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8/15/2005 3:57 PM
on the beatles subject, anyone read the observer article on john lennon yesterday? - basically argued that he was far less recognised these days.... the recent massive observer poll of people who listen to music had 56% of british 16 to 24 year olds unable to put a name to a picture of john lennon... they wouldn't be very good in a table quiz, would they? incidentally, i 100% disagree about the beatles being overrated - are you mad?

off the post

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8/15/2005 4:05 PM
quote: Originally posted by Vent My Spleen Er...ummm..I was "there" at the time of Teen Spirit and still don't unserstand how it is regarded as some sort of musical crossing of the rubicon. Don't get me wrong, Nirvana were a good band and I had some of their stuff prior to Teen Spirit breaking but there were dozens of bands with similar and often better offerings at the time. I'll put on my flame proof trousers now. Nirvana were the first "alternative" (for want of a better word) to crossover to playlists on MTV and were literally catepulted into the conciousness of a generation tortured by years of Kylie, Bros and Wacko Jacko on the box. Personally I think they were more important in terms of a great many people discovering music outside of the mainstream that perhaps their actual music justified. A bit of a Zeitgeist. I think their best album is MTV unplugged.

off the post

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8/15/2005 4:10 PM
quote: Originally posted by Antistar Faithless! What's the f**king deal with them? Crappy,simplistic, supposedly 'really uplifting, maan' 2-note synth pop overlaid with that geezer's rambling, 'we are one' cod-philosophising. Tripe. Some of their stuff is alright. "Don't Leave" is a great tune; when I first heard it I could'nt believe it was by them. It's very unfaithless.

Gar

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8/15/2005 4:35 PM
It is laughable and painful at the same time to hear someone state that The Beatles are over-rated. Personally, I believe they are the greatest band of all time and like Daragh, they opened up a whole new world of music for me. Every single album of theirs has at least two great tracks on it while some albums are just jam-packed with classic tunes ('Sgt. Pepper's', 'White Album', 'Revolver', 'Let It Be'). It's bad for your health to not consider The Beatles one of the best bands ever!!!

clare

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8/15/2005 5:09 PM
i dont blame the beatles for oasis i was just drawing a connection between two bands, one an influence on the other, that i think have been over-rated, though oasis more than the beatles who have produced some great records and had a more positive influence on the bands that followed them. oasis had two good albums years ago and are still considered to be a great british band. bollocks. i'm not denying that they're a good band but i think as a whole the beatles have definitely been over-rated, having two good tracks on an album doesnt make it a good record for me. yeah, they may have 'opened the door for a lot more artists to create' but their own music doesn't quite do it for me as much as other bands, sorry.

nerraw

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8/15/2005 5:24 PM
Difference between over-rated and a band you don't like. I can't stand the beatles but wouldn't for one second suggest they are over-rated. Huge fan of Pearl Jam and to suggest they are in anyway similar to nickleback is laughable. You don't like them far enough but they ain't like nickleback. Pete Doherty is completely over-rated as is Oasis.

roseanne barrs armpit

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8/15/2005 8:26 PM
sunburned hand of the man, the red krayola, gastr del sol, avarus, AMM, KMD, and noxagt = some of the most overrrated s**te of all time

Pilchard

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8/16/2005 8:50 AM
quote: Pete Doherty is completely over-rated as is Oasis. Pete Doherty is James Blunt for people who think they're too cool for school

clare

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8/16/2005 4:08 PM
hahaha!

benni

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8/16/2005 4:16 PM
quote: Originally posted by roseanne barrs armpit sunburned hand of the man No man!! Even if it was just a case that you dont like them fair enough but in terms of 'overrated' you very rarely hear anybody dropping their name... well comparitively anyway.

roseanne barrs armpit

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8/16/2005 8:14 PM
quote: Originally posted by benni quote: Originally posted by roseanne barrs armpit sunburned hand of the man No man!! Even if it was just a case that you dont like them fair enough but in terms of 'overrated' you very rarely hear anybody dropping their name... well comparitively anyway. what are ya on about. people haven't shut up harping on about Rare Wood like it was Sov gott Rose-Marie or something. round my block anyways

aidan

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8/16/2005 9:26 PM
I already discussed at length on another thread how I feel that Mr Starbucks himself, Bob Dylan, is ridiculously over-rated and mythologised. For those of you who weren't there, much ridicule and venom ensued . Oh well. I'll just take solace from the fact that I'm right and all of you Dylan-lovers are wrong...

Pilchard

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Posts:699

8/17/2005 9:28 AM
i always thought Eminem was hugely over-rated (especially by people who didnt have a clue about hip-hop) and now, I now he is! "Exhaustion". Jeez, I'm exhausted and I still turn up for work

stephen

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8/17/2005 10:09 AM
Great thread! But unless I am mistaken, surely we are missing what is undoubtedly the most over-rated band of recent years - The Libertines. I love my ramshackle rock as much as the next man but these talentless, sub-pub band pretenders really do my head in. And how in under God has Mick Jones picked up so many rewards for his production on their albums! It sounds like he taped a pickup to each of their badly tuned instruments and left them to it... As for the eulogising of Pete Doherty... what a waste of space he is. It seems the NME is desperate for this generation to have their own Kurt. Or am I being too cynical?

benni

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8/17/2005 10:26 AM
Re: The Libertines I remember hearing them first before 'Up the Bracket' was even releaseed. There was a real buzz about them and I remember buying 'Dont Look Back into the Sun' and thinking it was really good manic stuff. The album wasnt outstanding but still - it had track like 'A Time for Heroes' and 'Up the bracket' but unfortunatley the press whore onslaught and egotism that followoed ruined any chance of them developing into what could have been a pretty good band. oh well.

spurtacus

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Posts:229

8/17/2005 10:35 AM
The Libertines were great, listen to Tell the King and The Good Old Days off Up the Bracket, the media destroyed them, Doherty seems to have lost the plot completely, loada b****x

Daragh

Advanced Member
Posts:666

8/17/2005 10:42 AM
the libertines first album is very good alright, listened to it again the other day, good stuff. Pity they threw it all away though.

Pilchard

Advanced Member
Posts:699

8/17/2005 11:01 AM
interesting blame game about the libertines. many bands have survived - and thrived - after a media onslaught. i really think they just didnt have the smarts or chops to better their early work. it happens a lot - how many second albums are just not as good as the debut? Some bands can cope magnificently (heard the new Franz Ferdinand single and it sounds amazing and bodes well for the album) and others just fall to pieces. The media have nothing to do with that - its down to the people involved themselves In the case of the Libertines, it was the fact that they listened to Alan McGee (their manager) and Geoff Travis (Rough Trade, their record company) and went for the whole sensationalist angle, instead of knuckling down and writing really good songs Drop The Dope - Make Doherty History

benni

Advanced Member
Posts:947

8/17/2005 11:08 AM
quote: Originally posted by Pilchard . The media have nothing to do with that - its down to the people involved themselves 100%

spurtacus

Basic Member
Posts:229

8/17/2005 11:26 AM
i liked their second album aswell, fkin hate that st on the cover playin up to all that heroin s**te, yer right though i suppose it was management and the band themselves that are to blame for playin up to all that sensationalist nonsense

Daragh

Advanced Member
Posts:666

8/17/2005 12:38 PM
id say it was probably a bit of bad management too, as well as the obvious weakness on their part. Yeah, the second album cover is fking ridiculous. Would be kinda hard, in their situation though, to keep your st together, specially if youre a bit f**ked up/hedonistic already

Unicron

Veteran Member
Posts:1696

8/18/2005 1:38 PM
Heard f**k Forever today, it's horrendous.

mcgyver

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Posts:29

8/18/2005 4:42 PM
Amen Unicorn,shabby, badly recorded muck.

Pilchard

Advanced Member
Posts:699

8/19/2005 1:56 PM
another highly over-rated band to add to the list that i just remembered when i heard them on the radio earlier - REM. early stuff was good but the new stuff is just so bloody awful.

Unicron

Veteran Member
Posts:1696

8/19/2005 7:03 PM
I'd disagree with that, everyone thinks their new stuff is bloody awful. If they had legions of people defending the new material then yeah I'd go along with it but the general opinion mirrors your own. Unless you consider the older good stuff to not be all that good.

aidanc

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Posts:17

8/21/2005 7:06 PM
My vote goes to The Beach Boys. Unlike many of the bands mentioned in this thread, The Beach Boys are actually revered as one of the greatest bands of all time by many music critics, up there with The Beatles. But personally I think the produced sappy bubblegum pop.

Una

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Posts:1721

8/21/2005 7:26 PM
and the Beatles didn't?!

Daragh

Advanced Member
Posts:666

8/21/2005 8:03 PM
some of the Beach Boys surfer tunes are great, good time summer music. And then theres Pet Sounds, and there are very few albums as good as that, in any style, its as close to perfection as "Electric Ladyland" is. Oh dont think the Beatles really produced "sappy bubblegum pop" either, some of their early pop stuff is great, She Loves You, Twist n Shout, I Wanna Hold Your Hand...

aidanc

New Member
Posts:17

8/21/2005 10:08 PM
I can't say I'm a huge fan of the Beatles music but the impact they have had on modern music is undeniably enormous, I think it is much less so with the Beach Boys, at least positive impact that is. But of course when it comes to rating bands it is obviously highly subjective and everyone has their own opinion.

Una

Veteran Member
Posts:1721

8/21/2005 10:13 PM
im not to about to start arguing about the merits of band that split up decades ago... BUT (s**t, cant help myself) in my opinion, Beach Boys had a far bigger impact RE production, which was completely inovative, unlike the Beatles material which followed a linear legacy of guitar based music already laid.

Pilchard

Advanced Member
Posts:699

8/22/2005 9:16 AM
Mogwai. One of those pointless acts that every critic and fanboy with a typewriter is always praising. Awful band

Trix

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Posts:92

8/20/2007 7:47 AM
Is it just me or are Arcade Fire very overrated.....? runs for cover

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/20/2007 8:19 AM
unlike the Beatles material which followed a linear legacy of guitar based music already laid. Huh?

Quint

Basic Member
Posts:209

8/20/2007 8:30 AM
Posted By Trix on 20 Aug 2007 7:47 AM Is it just me or are Arcade Fire very overrated.....? runs for cover They have released one classic album 'Funeral', one of THE debuts of all time. The follow-up 'Neon Bible' is rubbish (apart from No Cars Go). They're good live but I've seen much better.I saw them at EP 2005 but I was much more impressed by Goldfrapp and Kraftwerk at the same festival. I think this frighteningly intense level of adoration for the band is out of control, especially in Ireland. Good band but, yes,overrated. (That's 2 of us now, Trix, where are you going to hide? I've changed my identity already and am about to fly to Australia for a new life. But I think the Church of Arcade Fire are on to me already, they're going burn me at the stake as warm-up entertainment for the Big Top gig at Phoenix Park if I don't get out of the country by midnight.)

PARTON

Basic Member
Posts:188

8/20/2007 8:40 AM
Dont like them either, some of the tracks on the first album were excellent and pretty inspiring but I cant get excited about them at all... killers....crap live Mogwai...agree, seen em live twice....zzzzzzzzzboring....i guess its all about taste though...... joy division are overrated..extremely overrated...and anything with pete ffing doherty.... and that london set, lily allen and kate nash etc...if they were singing in a dublin accent would they sell? i think not

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/20/2007 8:49 AM
In a world where Foo Fighters, Red Hot Chilli Peppers and Greenday are the biggest bands in the world, I reckon you can’t rate Arcade Fire highly enough.

JamesT

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Posts:98

8/20/2007 8:59 AM
Don't know about the most over-rated bands of all time (Nirvana do spring to mind though) but for me the most over-rated Irish bands of recent times are - The Immediate The Blizzards Delorentos

Quint

Basic Member
Posts:209

8/20/2007 9:15 AM
Posted By Pilchard on 22 Aug 2005 9:16 AM Mogwai. One of those pointless acts that every critic and fanboy with a typewriter is always praising. Awful band The reason 'Every critic and fanboy is praising them' is because they are one of the best bands on the planet. Live, they are utterly, completely and unequivocally without equal.

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/21/2007 3:30 AM
Posted By aidanc on 21 Aug 2005 10:08 PM I can't say I'm a huge fan of the Beatles music but the impact they have had on modern music is undeniably enormous, I think it is much less so with the Beach Boys, at least positive impact that is. Its worth noting too that the Beach Boys had an important influence on the Beatles, especially McCartney. Hearing Pet Sounds spurred them onto grander things with Sgt Pepper. Like that album or not you can hear Brian Wilsons influence all over it - the chamber-pop strings of She's Leaving Home, the calliope on Mr Kite, the childhood nostalgia on Strawberry Fields/Penny Lane. I think the Beach Boys were certainly one of the best bands to ever come out of America. Is that overrating them? Maybe they're slightly overrated in that they've produced more s**t than good over the decades but their output from 1964-1972 alone sets their legend in stone. The Beach Boys influence is fairly evident today. You can hear them in Jim O'Rourke, Beachwood Sparks, Wilco etc… No, they're not as influential as the Beatles, I agree. But who is? I realise their twee-ness and soppy nature can be an issue though, but it doesn't bother me, I love'em.

Carlsberg

Basic Member
Posts:215

8/23/2007 12:00 PM
Just joined this thread... rolls up sleeves.. now... where is that F****r who said Kid A was Radioheads only good album..!!?

floodzer

Basic Member
Posts:181

8/24/2007 2:13 AM
well The Who suck... and in my opinion Zeppelin deserve their acclaim. Kid A is not the best radiohead album but its a really good album. I actually would place Hail To The Thief up there though, despite tracks like The Gloaming...

PeterQuaife

Basic Member
Posts:436

8/24/2007 4:45 AM
surely The Beach Boys Pet Sounds sound really came to the fore after Brian Wilson heard the Beatles producing music in the studio that didnt necessarily have to be produced live on stage..... PQ

PeterQuaife

Basic Member
Posts:436

8/24/2007 4:51 AM
Posted By JamesT on 8/20/2007 8:59:51 AM Subject: RE: The most over-rated bands of all time Message: Don't know about the most over-rated bands of all time (Nirvana do spring to mind though) but for me the most over-rated Irish bands of recent times are - The Immediate The Blizzards Delorentos Yer awful sore on decent Irish bands.... The Immediate were a quality band, on record and live. Delorentos too are a decent band. Over-rated for me, Bjork, pants. Springsteen, zzz PQ

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/24/2007 4:57 AM
Posted By PeterQuaife on 24 Aug 2007 4:45 AM surely The Beach Boys Pet Sounds sound really came to the fore after Brian Wilson heard the Beatles producing music in the studio that didnt necessarily have to be produced live on stage..... PQ Sure. I never said there wasn't any give and take.

PeterQuaife

Basic Member
Posts:436

8/24/2007 5:09 AM
its all about the give and take for sure PQ

diego_maradona

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Posts:53

8/28/2007 7:06 AM
I'll chip in with the following; -Queen: Abba with guitars -Manics: agree with most points made up till now. Impressively average -White Stripes: I'll take the point that they may be excellent live and I know the blues can be repetitive but cmon! It's the same thing over and over, and much of the stuff I've heard sounds so top heavy that it's virtually unlistenable - to my ears - at high volume. Grating.. Although I do like Doorbell -U2: Maybe this one has been mentioned before, but I think the most damning fact about U2 is that after all the albums are sold, tour records are broken and Bono has become the famous man on Earth there will remain the point that their influence on the music that has followed them is minimal. I, for one, can not recall any music interview with a respected band/artist naming U2 as inspiration. Why can't I think of anymore?!? I used to hate so much music...I just don't seem to have the time these days..

Binokular

Veteran Member
Posts:1665

8/28/2007 8:30 AM
Posted By diego_maradona on 28 Aug 2007 7:06 AM . I, for one, can not recall any music interview with a respected band/artist naming U2 as inspiration. . Probably because they aren't a cool band to namedrop right now? "Oh yeah, loike, we're totally into gang of four/joy division/insert uber-hip obscure band from the past here" I think many bands lie about their actual influences, or choose only to be influenced by "cool" stuff, or don't actuall recognise what has actually influenced them, perhaps subliminally. Either way there's often a bit of artistic dishonesty going on. Great bands often have cheesy influences. Take Smashing Pumpkins, their influences were Cheap Trick, Black Sabbath, ELO, etc. in 1995, when it wasn't cool. I'm not saying U2 are the most out-there revolutionary band by any stretch of the imagination, and have co-opted a lot of other peoples ideas, but I do think a number of bands have been influenced by them, in the case of the more obvious ones though (Coldplay, Keane etc.), I wish they hadn't. I can guarantee you though that somewhere out there, some kid out there is discovering Achtung Baby or Zooropa for the first time and getting exicited about music...

Quint

Basic Member
Posts:209

8/28/2007 9:01 AM
Absolutely spot-on, Binokular. New bands will never name U2 as an influence as they are perceived as being deeply uncool (the same way serious music fans will never mention them also) but Interpol and especially Editors owe a huge debt to U2, especially early U2. 'War', 'Boy' and 'October' is ALL OVER Editors first album...and any band that is prepared to put on a huge stage show will always have 'Zoo TV' at the back of their minds, hoping they can top it, but they never will as I honestly can't see how Zoo TV can be bettered, and that was 15 years ago! Even watching it on TV is mindblowing. ''I can guarantee you though that somewhere out there, some kid out there is discovering Achtung Baby or Zooropa for the first time and getting exicited about music...'' So true. A lot of young kids probably think of Bono as that small man in the sunglasses always banging on about Africa etc but when they hear 'Achtung, Baby' they will probably have trouble thinking it's the same guy. 'Achtung, Baby' is a masterpiece and probably the greatest album ever by an Irish band. IT's such a pity that the quality of their output has taken such a nose-dive in the 15 years since.

diego_maradona

New Member
Posts:53

8/28/2007 9:56 AM
I suppose I should have added to my U2 comments that I do rate highly Achtung Baby in particular and bits & pieces of the two following albums. However if you take some tracks away from the earlier stuff and listen to the later stuff you will hear a band that have been good but not great for much of their career. Achtung Baby one of the best Irish albums of all time? Undoubtedly, but will it ever be seen as important in the greater scheme of music history? I doubt it. It is possible that other musicians do not think it cool to namedrop U2 as an inspiration, but I still think they would be mentioned much more were they truly an influence. An example of Smashing Pumpkins - a good band with one great album - namedropping older 'cheesier' music does not back up your argument really. Particularly as Cheap Trick were from the same city and were huge when Corgan was growing up, and ELO have written some absolute classic pop songs.

Binokular

Veteran Member
Posts:1665

8/28/2007 4:29 PM
Smashing Pumpkins were happy namedrop cheesy stuff, because Corgan didn't really give a monkeys what people thought, which is part of the reason he sorta went off at the deep end. The fact that Cheap Trick were in the same city actually sorta proves my point. Corgan absorbed what was around him, people are influenced by their surroundings, you can't deny where you're coming from. The point is a band doesn't actually have to be that good to be influential. They just have to be around. "Will Achtung baby be seen as important in the greater scheme of music" - I dunno, anyway, that's just perception and the concencus of "cool", it's the sort of thing that leads journos to do those 100 most important albums of all time lists. Give me strength! What I do know is that it's a great album and a lot of people listened to it, so it's bound to have some cultural influence? I think of it as a gateway album too, people will listen to this and have their appetite whetted for music thats a bit adventurous, it makes you wonder "what else is out there?" It did for me, and has hugely shaped my tastes, then again. I'm not a musician. People often judge a bands influence by what they can hear of that band in other bands records, however just because a band doesn't actually sound like their influences does not mean they have not been influenced, if that makes sense? For example, take Lali Puna and The Go! Team. Two very different bands, but both claim to be heavily influenced by Sonic Youth. It's not immediately apparent, but it's the spirit of that band they have copied, not the sound. One of the reasons a lot bands seem so stale these days is they are conceptual but with a narrow frame of reference at the same time. It's like they've decided what sort of band is "correct", and taken all the "right" influences and then started a band. That just isn't going to work, you have to give things room to breathe.

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/29/2007 3:14 AM
Thats a good post binok. Well put. The comment about Zoo TV is spot on too. I remember during that Seven Ages of Rock series on the BBC, they had an episode on stadium rock and someone commented that ZooTV is the only stage show that is actually enhanced by the fact that its in a huge stadium/field. They really got it right with that tour. If Bono was listening to Joy Division and the Clash in the early years, where did he get that posh English accent from?

PeterQuaife

Basic Member
Posts:436

8/29/2007 5:22 AM
from listening to the Clash

Quint

Basic Member
Posts:209

8/29/2007 6:37 AM
What posh English accent??????

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

8/29/2007 7:34 AM
On the early albums, Boy in particular, he effects a sort of up-market English accent to his singing voice. I was just wondering who he nicked this from, since it doesn't really sound like his main influences of the time. Took him about four years to shake it and start singing with his own accent too. Maybe thats how they talked in Ballymun back in 1979.

saulc

New Member
Posts:20

9/2/2007 8:39 AM
To anyone who's not sure about Springsteen take a look at these video's on youtube. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAvolRT3sX4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-8LUvW9qv4&mode=related&search= There both from his performance at the Hammersmith Odeon in '75. It is, at least in my humble opinion, the best live music you will see captured on film. You can buy the CD of the concert or for a few more bucks buy the DVD with the Born to Run anniversary edition, you wont be disappointed. As to the whole over rated thing I'm gonna put my head on the block and say I think Hendrix is over rated...

petethedrummer

New Member
Posts:38

9/3/2007 11:43 AM
Posted By diego_maradona -Queen: Abba with guitars Abba have tons of great songs! Posted By diego_maradona -U2: ..........the point that their influence on the music that has followed them is minimal. I, for one, can not recall any music interview with a respected band/artist naming U2 as inspiration. The Edge's guitar playing is genius and a HUGE influence on modern music. Yes, it is simple melodies and a delay pedal (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8EDuK46ZqFM). But he is repeatedly name checked by guitar players....I'm not a big fan of most of their music or their politics but the Edge is/was a genius.

Binokular

Veteran Member
Posts:1665

9/3/2007 11:59 AM
Posted By saulc on 02 Sep 2007 8:39 AM As to the whole over rated thing I'm gonna put my head on the block and say I think Hendrix is over rated... Yes and no, he's a guitar hero but people focus on his technical ability and playing innovation and not his wider musical and songwriting talent. You can't say he's that overrated when a turgid band like Led Zeppelin are mentioned in the same breath, he was lightyears ahead of them.

Peejay

Basic Member
Posts:340

9/4/2007 3:39 AM
Posted By Binokular on 03 Sep 2007 11:59 AM Posted By saulc on 02 Sep 2007 8:39 AM As to the whole over rated thing I'm gonna put my head on the block and say I think Hendrix is over rated... Yes and no, he's a guitar hero but people focus on his technical ability and playing innovation and not his wider musical and songwriting talent. Yeah, plus the songs he's most associated with, Hey Joe and (probably) Foxy Lady, are far from his best. Hey Joe was a cover too. The three studio albums he released during his lifetime are superb.

Sebastian Dangerfield

New Member
Posts:14

9/4/2007 10:12 AM
Maybe I'm reiterating what someone else has already said, but I couldn't ignore this thread and not register my dislike-nay, hatred-of The Doors. (Admittedly, my distaste for them is due as much to the kind of arrogant, pseudo-intellectual audience they attract as it is to their endless musical masturbation and the sixth-form doggerel that Morrison deemed "poetry.")

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