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Last Post 12/9/2003 2:14 PM by  Q2
What's the most overrated album of all time?
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Q2
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12/9/2003 2:14 PM
    Howdy all, What are the most overrated albums of all time? In my humblest of opinions, 1. U2 - The Joshua Tree Why is that considered such a classic? I find it pretty average to tell you the truth. I thought All That You Can't Leave Behind wasn't great either, but I can't fault Achtung Baby, that's a great album 2. Damian Rice - O At the risk of being unpopular I know, but I've tried to listen to this record about 10 times and could never make it to the end of it before switching it off. I think it's an incessant bore. 3. Oasis - What's the Story Morning Glory? Probably due to a teeny-bopper thing, but I think's it's a bit comical that this is among the 10 highest selling records of all time. 4. The Thrills - So Much For The City This is an album that has been blown way out of proportion in my view. Any thoughts on this folks? Q2
    Dwight
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    12/9/2003 2:31 PM
    I have tried very hard to like the Flaming Lips album but apart from maybe 2 songs I can't see even remotely what all the fuss was about. I like the Thrills album and it has been overrated by some people but I think it has been underrated by other people so I reckon on average it gets what it deserves....
    The Human Fly
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    12/9/2003 4:12 PM
    any album radiohead have released since the bends
    Binokular
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    12/9/2003 4:28 PM
    Q2, I totally agree with you about Damien rice, he just lacks any kind of sonic ambition. I like the Joshua Tree, but would definitely agree that Achtung Baby is a far superior album. I think a lot of Pink Floyd albums like "Dark side of the moon" and "The Wall" are overrated. They're extremely well recorded, produced and mastered albums, the technical standard of musicianship is very high, but they are just so boring. Proof that big and clever does not always mean good.
    Vent My Spleen
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    12/9/2003 5:34 PM
    I suppose you have to think of the music against the backdrop of the times in which it was recorded. DSideotheMoon was pretty ambitious stuff and very innovative - it laid the groundwork for the whole ambient side of music as we know it today. As for the Joshua Tree, it was a balls out rock and roll album in a time where everything was either synth pop or completely overproduced (check some of Springsteen's work from that era, Dancing in the Dark for instance). U2 went back to basics, channeling the dirty blues that had inspired the Stones & Zeppelin in the sixties. It was they album that made basic rock cool again. That said, I like neither of these albums (particularly the U2 one although my judgement may be clouded by the memory of the awful Rattle and Hum thingy). OK, they might me over-exposed but I'd find it difficult to say overrated. Over rated is a term I'd apply to David Gray, Damien Rice, The Strokes....
    conor-immediate
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    12/9/2003 7:57 PM
    "Vent My Spleen" - is that name a reference to Pavement?
    vandala
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    12/10/2003 7:22 AM
    "Nevermind". Dull as dishwater in my book.
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 8:30 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Vent My Spleen
    I suppose you have to think of the music against the backdrop of the times in which it was recorded. DSideotheMoon was pretty ambitious stuff and very innovative - it laid the groundwork for the whole ambient side of music as we know it today.
    The thing is Dark Side of the moon is regarded as a "classic" album, a truly classic album should stand up just as well today as it did in 1973. I should be able to enjoy it today regardless of context. DSOTM just does not stand up today for me, yes it was ambitious, yes it was innovative but that does not make it good by default. I would also question its influence on ambient music, this album was more the tail end of psychedelic music rather than a move into a new genre. While it undoubtedly had some influence, Brian Eno was a far greater influence on the genre.
    Vent My Spleen
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    12/10/2003 8:36 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by conor-immediate
    "Vent My Spleen" - is that name a reference to Pavement?
    It is a partial nod of the head to the excellent Pavement and a good description of what we all do on discussion boards (well, it sounded a damn sight better than "Pulling it out of my arse"!)
    Vent My Spleen
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    12/10/2003 8:52 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Binokular The thing is Dark Side of the moon is regarded as a "classic" album, a truly classic album should stand up just as well today as it did in 1973. I should be able to enjoy it today regardless of context. I would also question its influence on ambient music, this album was more the tail end of psychedelic music rather than a move into a new genre. While it undoubtedly had some influence, Brian Eno was a far greater influence on the genre.
    I'm not so sure I'd expect a classic album to stand up as well today as it did when it was released, very few albums do. I'd regard a classic album as one that changed the course of music, and DSOTM certainly did. Granted, Eno is the granddaddy of ambient but I also feel that the commercial success of DSOTM meant a lot more ambient music made it to disc in the 70s. I suppose a better example would be The Sex Pistols - the music, playing and songwriting were piss but it is a classic because of the influence it had. Ditto anything by the Velvet Underground - barely sold an album in their day but every musician of note through the eighties had their stuff. I suppose, it all depends on your definition of classic. Me, I can name a string of classic albums that I really do not like but will readily acknowledge the influence. P.S. I'd regard the new Outkast album as a classic of the future.
    Q2
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    12/10/2003 9:15 AM
    Spleeno, I notice you also mentioned the Strokes being overrated in another thread as well as this one and I'd agree. "IS This It?" was good but it wasn't THAT good. And whatever I've heard from the new album doesn't sound much different from before, much less original either. So much so, I haven't even bothered to buy it. I'd agree they're overexposed. Q2
    Q2
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    12/10/2003 9:17 AM
    Incidently, I thought Gemma Hayes' "Night On My Side" got far more recognition than it deserved. It was a bit too Sheryl Crow-ish for me. There's loads of female artists playing in Dublin alone that are just as good or better than her. I suppose she was one of the lucky ones. Q2
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 9:46 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Vent My Spleen I suppose, it all depends on your definition of classic.
    Absolutely, the fact that Dark side of the Moon divides opinion shows that it has obviously had a great cultural impact and in that sense is a classic. I guess my definiton of a classic is a record that as well as changing the direction of music, it still has the vitality to allow you to respond to it on an honest, human level. I still listen to the Velvet Underground on a regular basis (OK maybe not White Light, White Heat), ditto Kraftwerk and New Order. On the other hand, to totally contradict myself ... A Love Supreme by John Coltrane is another record I regard as a classic even though I rarely listen to it. I have to be in the mood for it as it requires a bit more effort to listen to, but it rewards that effort.
    Dromed
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    12/10/2003 9:52 AM
    Vandala have to disagree there...Nevermind was a gem of a record at the time for me, I loved it and played it to death. I know I risk being lamped for this but I think the Sex Pistols were somewhat overrated, the first time I heard 'Never Mind The b****x' I was expecting to be blown away. 'What's the Story Morning Glory' must have been one of the most over hyped records ever. I have to confess also that Pet Sounds was never as good as I had thought it would be either - I know that's like blasphmey but to be honest when I heard it it left me a bit disappointed, it's not a bad record at all, I just feel it's not as outstanding as it's always been made out to be.
    john@soundweb.ie
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    12/10/2003 9:52 AM
    agree with THE THRILLS inclusion, does nothing for me and nothing i have seen of their live appearances would help to change my mind either. i may get stick for this one but MY BLOODY VALENTINE - is this it? out of time, out of tune - anyone?
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 10:07 AM
    quote:
    Originally posted by john@soundweb.ie
    i may get stick for this one but MY BLOODY VALENTINE
    Yep, stick you will get, its a personal favourite of mine, but I can understand why people don't like it. Loveless is an incredibly dense, noisy record which means it can be hard to make out the melodies, kinda like those magic eye pictures where you supposedly stare at them until you see a 3D image (they never worked for me). If you can't stand its density, you're gonna hate it.
    stephen
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    12/10/2003 12:32 PM
    Hmmmm.... good question. I find New Order over-rated (apart from a few genius singles). But, for me, the person who consistently passes by my musical sensors is Bob Dylan. I don't own a single album of his. I've heard some great singles, some wonderful words. But few great tunes. Of the ones I have heard, I would rate Blood on the Tracks as my over-rated album. One great tune does not a great album make. Also over-rated? Sgt Pepper (one of the Beatle's worst), anything by the Who, Jeff Buckly (over-wrought.... had great potential though). Also an incredibly over-rated album is the new double by Outkast. The reviews have been ecstatic and I loved Stankonia. But Speakerboxx is aimless, tuneless and a real effort to sit through.
    Dromed
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    12/10/2003 12:58 PM
    Stephen can't agree with you on New Order - I think Substance was a seminal record and Get Ready was another amazin album (though not as influential granted as Substance), or Sgt. Peppers, which I reckon had a huge impact on music, or the Who because of their sheer showmanship, brilliant songs, energy and endurance (also some really beautiful moments on the Quadraphenia soundtrack, 'Love Reign O'er Me' a great piece of music), or Jeff Buckley for being a fleeting precious beautiful moment in the history of music, 'Grace' makes me weak at the knees for its unpretenciousness and its humility - but I defo agree with Bob Dylan - I've never been able to raise the slightest interest in him at all - don't know why, I think I could listen to other artists doing his songs but I just can't stomach him at all.
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 1:07 PM
    I totally agree Dromed, except maybe Sgt. Peppers, which I dont have as strong opinion about either way. Stephen, I have to admire your audacity though, you definitely get the "most sacred cows tipped over with one post" high score!
    Vent My Spleen
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    12/10/2003 1:09 PM
    Wow! Some fascinating choices. Thrills - agree. Valentine - not clssic but I really like their stuff Nina Hynes - over rated Strokes - I think they are more about being cool and image than the music Nevermind - A really good album but I regard it in the same way as he Sex pistols, the album is the most recognised and associated with the grunge direction of music at the time. The Beatles - I think pretty much all of their work is overrated. Outkast - I love the new album but time will tell. In an era where hip hop is measured by the number of times you'vee been shot, it is great to hear a act really moving left field of this formulaic genre As for Dylan, he was under my musical radar for many years and my interest was only really started by the vast number of great covers of his tunes. If you can get over his voice, the quality and simplicity of his songs are unparalleled. Blood on the Tracks is one is a personal fav - check the venom in the sentiment of Idiot Wind.
    pablohoney
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    12/10/2003 1:12 PM
    what about this whole thing about dark side of the moon and the wizard of oz if anyone knows what iam talking about then i dont believe this album is overrated because to be able to synchronise DSOTM with this film is a work of genius
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 1:30 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by pablohoney
    what about this whole thing about dark side of the moon and the wizard of oz if anyone knows what iam talking about then i dont believe this album is overrated because to be able to synchronise DSOTM with this film is a work of genius
    Wasn't really aware of supposed synchronisation between Dark Side of the Moon and Wizard of Oz before, but I am now thanks to the wonders of Google. Interesting, did Pink Floyd really plan it that way or is it the overactive imagination of stoned students with too much time on their hands? Who knows, either way it still doesn't make me want go and listen to DSOTM.
    eyeballkid
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    12/10/2003 1:35 PM
    have to agree with Dromed when he mentions Pet Sounds, esp. given the recent polls that put it as no. 1 album of all time. it's another one of these of it time records. fair enough no one did the things with sound that brian wilson achieved on the album, but in terms of songs (excepting Sloop John B) there's hardly anything on it that is better than their early surf stuff. give me 20 Golden Greats any day. as for Bob Dylan, listen to the Highway 61 Revisited LP and tell me that's not one of the greatest records ever made (of course i fully understand if people can't get past the nasal whine thing).
    flagman
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    12/10/2003 2:56 PM
    RE: Pets Sounds, some good points made about it alright. It's legendary status seems to have come more from the Beach Boys v Beatles rivalry of the mid sixties and Brian Wilson's maddening genius. Have to agree, I'd rather hear their older stuff, the effortless pop brilliance of 'I Get Around' and 'Help Me Rhonda' for example. And as for Sgt. Pepper, I understand the whole musical impact and all but Revolver is a far better record I think, and you get 'Tomorrow Never Knows' to boot, how's that for musical impact.
    Binokular
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    12/10/2003 3:15 PM
    Flagman good point about "Tomorrow Never Knows", I used to question if the Beatles had any real impact on modern music other than Oasis, then I heard a bootleg of the vocals of that song with the backing track from The Chemical Brothers "Setting Sun". The two tracks are so similar! Glad to hear I'm not the only one who holds the Beach Boys early stuff in high regard too. I guess Pet Sounds is regarded as the Beach Boys best album because its the first record where Brian Wilson isn't writing about surfing, cars and girls. (ironicaly Brian Wilson did not actually write the lyrics on pet sounds, he only provided the lyrical idea for each song). The thing is those supposedly inane early Beach Boys records are so much more fun, I particularly like the "little deuce coupe" album with tracks like "409" and "little honda". On that album you can almost hear the big Chevy V8s and smell the petrol fumes and burning tyres of the dragstrip.
    Q2
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    12/10/2003 4:21 PM
    My word, I didn't think this would attract this many responses. Mind you, I'm caught a little on some of the choices: I'm a bit disappointed that the Flaming Lips have been mentioned, granted it scored ridiculously high praise on its release but it deserved it for its originality (if that's a word) I'm surprised that "Nevermind" has been described as "dishwater", where would we have been at the time if Nirvana hadn't released that. I would agree with the Dylan & Beatles choices though, I think those guys have had their moments certainly but their iconic status is unwarranted in my view. To say that the Beatles "changed" the face of music as so many journalists/fans have said before is utter bollocks in my opinion. I was especially disappointed to see Nina Hynes mentioned though, I think she's easily Ireland's best female artist. Gemma Hayes is far more overrated than her. Keep them coming! Q2
    Vent My Spleen
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    12/10/2003 4:44 PM
    quote:
    Originally posted by Q2
    I was especially disappointed to see Nina Hynes mentioned though, I think she's easily Ireland's best female artist. Gemma Hayes is far more overrated than her.
    Doh! Boy is my face red! I of course meant Gemma Hayes - not Nina Hynes, slip of the old thumbs on the keyboard. No disrespect to Gemma, a perfectly good album but it was rediculously hyped.
    Q2
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    12/11/2003 9:23 AM
    Good Lad Spleeno, Easy on the humility though! She's playing in Dublin on Decemeber 19th. Anyone going? Q2
    Eric
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    12/11/2003 10:29 AM
    I really don't get the whole M&M craze, I feel I'm the only person who doesn't like his music. In a recent Q poll of 1000 best ever songs 'Slim Shady' was no 6! I find that comical. Much of his success is down to MTV playing his music 24 hours a day. Agreed - Damien Rice, good but not that good.
    Q2
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    12/11/2003 11:56 AM
    Hmmm, good point, that never occured to me. I think Eminem's music is a pile of arse, "Stan" being the only possible exception but even then, it's not that good. I reckon a lot of his success is due to teeny-boppers thinking he's cool 'cos he's profane and all that malarkey. So will the real Slim Shady please sit down and shut the f**k up for once? Q2
    stephen
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    12/11/2003 3:43 PM
    I'm glad I've gotten some agreement on the Dylan front. Every single album is hyped as some phenomenal comeback. My arse... I've even been suckered into buying his latest by the fact that Rolling Stone voted it the best album of the year. What a mistake - it's cheap blues and whimsy. Crap. As for my other choices? Describing something as over-rated does not mean you think it's rubbish - just that the volume of type attributed to it is not proportional to its musical worth. Hence my inclusion of Jeff Buckley and The Who ( come to think of it, Sgt Pepper too ). Jeff's album has some lovely music but also has a fair few indulgences and dirge on it for my taste - I think he would have knocked that album for 6, had he not passed away. And that's the crux of his fame... he is no longer here to soil his image. The Who have made some of the worst rock music I have ever heard. Some great singles though, but they are consistently bracketed with Led Zep, the Stones etc as amongst one of England's greatest ever bands. Arse I say... Knocking sacred cows off their perch is a fine trait to have... Still. Go buy Magnet's latest album... now there's something to savour.
    Q2
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    12/11/2003 4:07 PM
    I'd agree with the over-rated nature of The Who, in fact they're rubbish. And could someone please explain to me the over-significance of the Rolling Stones? I cannot for the life of me figure out what their appeal is. Q2
    eyeballkid
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    12/11/2003 4:15 PM
    ha ha. does anyone on this forum like any bands from the sixties. i think every single significant group from one of music's defining eras has been trashed. ah well, as long as nobody has a pop at the velvet underground or creedance clearwater revival that's fine by me.
    Brain of G
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    12/11/2003 10:13 PM
    Have to agree with you Q2 - I don't know much of the Who's music but what i do know i don't like. And what I don't like I don't want to know. It's a vicious circle you see... And I cannot stand The Rolling Stones. If ever I hear them on the radio or see them on the TV I turn the relevant appliance off without delay!
    peace03
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    12/15/2003 2:42 PM
    Lads, less of the slaggin about the Who. If you need any persuasion, get a copy of the 'Classic Albums' series, they did one on the Who - Who's Next....this is one of the greatest albums ever. I was lucky enough to see them before Entwhistle died and they would have blown the s**t out of any band around today, god knows what they would have been like before Keith Moon died. Also listen to the whole Quadrophenia soundtrack from start to finish on headphones....it's genius. I would have to say that even though I am a fan of Kid A and Amnesiac, they were very overrated. Thom Yorke admitted at the time he had been listening to a lot of the music coming from the Warp label and if you listen to any music from this label pre-Amnesiac/Kid A such as; Autechre, Plaid, Boards of Canada, Squarepusher, Aphex Twin to name but a few, you will find stuff which is much better quality. Also, I think the new Outkast album is great and will stand the test of time. Everything U2 have done is overrated.


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