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Last Post 2/23/2007 3:45 AM by  Eric
How has Phantom FM being back changed your listening habits
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klootfan
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2/19/2007 2:14 AM
    Phantom FM must be back a good 4 months at this stage is it ? Halloween 06 was it not.

    Anyway, I have to admit that from being a frequent listener in the past, I dont reckon Ive spent more then 30 minutes listening to them since they launched. I duno what it is really. When ive tuned in they just seemed to have been playing alot of the music they were playing in the old days... but that was probably just bad timing on my behalf.

    So what do people reckon. Are they any good. Should I save 105.whatever on my mp3 player radio station list ?
    off the post
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    2/19/2007 2:48 AM
    The only person I regularly listen to is Pearl on Sunday Mornings. I thinks she's great. The stuff she plays is just perfect for a chill out Sunday morning. The rest I can take or leave it.
    Binokular
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    2/19/2007 2:56 AM
    You Dubs do not know how good you have it so stop whingeing.

    Here in the radio blackout zone that is the foothills of the Comeragh mountains you can pick up the follwing in order of signal strength.

    1. Tipp FM - usual rural local radio stuff, fine if you want local news/talk radio, rubbish otherwise
    2. Today FM - Better than nothing
    3. Beat - They "yoof" radio station, despite it's name, the ratio of talk to music is not much better than sister station WLR, you actually wonder what the point of it is there is so much of an overlap between the two. It does have dance music show on a saturday night, but these are syndicates shows from the likes of Hed Kandi/Judge Jules and mainly play the more handbag side of house, so not really that interesting.
    4. RTE 1/2FM/Lyric, you all know well, can't really pick them up much, not that they're worth listening to.

    I was in Dublin last month (I know! Binokular venturing into the pale?The four horsemen of the Apocalyse will be next!), and driving around I have to say you guys are spoiled when it comes to radio. OK, Phantom isn't bleeding edge, it isn't "The Wire" on Resonance FM, but it's more than acceptable for keeping you happy while negotiating the traffic (speaking of which, you Dubs need to chill out maan, if you were cut up by a slightly lost looking old Alfa 75 on English plates, that was me, Sorry!).

    Overall, yeah Dublin Radio could be a little better, but it could be a LOT worse.
    Ally
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    2/19/2007 3:07 AM
    Posted By off the post on 19 Feb 2007 2:48 AM
    The only person I regularly listen to is Pearl on Sunday Mornings. I thinks she's great. The stuff she plays is just perfect for a chill out Sunday morning. The rest I can take or leave it.





    this is correct... pearl is the only programme i can listen to for more than about 20 minutes on the trot... in fact, i actively seek her program out...

    ...you get some odd good stuff on other programs as well but not nearly enough... in fact folks like that lunchtime guy and that heavy traffic guy play so much middling (and old) rock music that i quite often prefer listening to some pop on other stations... usually i turn over to some sort of talk radio though to get away from the noise...
    Unicron
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    2/19/2007 4:10 AM
    I usually make a point of listening to Pearl on Sundays. If I get the chance I listen to access all areas in the mornings (they had Trail Of Dead on last week) and the afternoon programme occasionally discusses some interesting stuff even though some of the music on it is a bit more rawk then I usually go for (and far too much Ash).
    klootfan
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    2/19/2007 4:20 AM
    Do the listeners still have as much input to the content. i.e. do txt requests get listened to
    aidan
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    2/19/2007 4:46 AM
    Posted By Unicron on 19 Feb 2007 4:10 AM
    I usually make a point of listening to Pearl on Sundays..




    Ah, I miss Pearl and her Sunday morning show - I used to wake up on Sunday mornings especially to listen to her while having breakfast and reading the Sunday papers. I don't have internet access at home so I can't listen to Phantom on the web just yet - soon, hopefully: and because of the time difference I'll have an hour later in bed on Sunday mornings before gettng up to listen to her!!!

    BTW in Paris there are two dedicated indie stations. One of them, Le Mouv', belongs to the state broadcaster. The other, Ouï FM, is independent and commercial and seems to me to have some links with XFM in London. Both have the tricky task of balancing audience-keeping 'classic indie hits' with fresh new music and eclectic programming - and Phantom is no different, as I recall Pete Reed/Simon Maher pointing out on this very discussion board. Ultimately it'll play what its listeners want it to play - which is as it should be, of course - but also introduce new music too.

    I always loved Phantom when I was living in Dublin and if the new legal station keeps its enthusiasm and individuality then it'll attract and keep a healthy audience. The best music show on French radio isn't on either of the indie stations but between 10-11pm on France Inter, a sort-of-equivalent of Newstalk. The show is called 'C'est Lenoir', presented by Bernard Lenoir, who simply plays the new music he has just heard and loves, live sessions with French and international acts (Neil Hannon did a fine session before Christmas), and look-backs on various themes - last week he did a special on shoe-gazing; chatted with guest about that scene, played Ride and especially My Bloody Valentine, saying how much he liked Kevin Shields' music, etc. It was a great hour of radio: it reminded me of Phantom.
    Peejay
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    2/19/2007 2:32 PM
    " Do the listeners still have as much input to the content. i.e. do txt requests get listened to "

    Yes, too much. It seems like all that Phantom (and most Irish radio) DJ's have to say it "send us a text". Literally every five minutes. For people (and Im not the only one) who have no interest in texting a radio show, this gets old fast. DJ's should know a little something about music, so they have something to talk (briefly) about in between songs. Instead they need constant encouragement from adoring texters in exchange for some Sonic Youth.

    I put Phantom on alot, usually when I don't have the concentration to listen to something of my own and just want music in the background. But I still want to hear something new (or old) that'll grab me. It rarely ever happens though. Phantom claims to be a cut above your average music station but they're not as adventurous as they like to think they are. When they're playing old stuff, its usually "the hit" (last night it was Light My Fire...yawn!) and for new bands they usually stick to one song and pummell that into the ground.

    I'm being a bit hard on them, its definitely one of the better stations, but I think I should stop listening to them for a while. Its starting to get to me!!

    Oh and another thing. Noel FUCKING Fogarty on the news desk.
    Phantomfmdublin
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    2/19/2007 4:24 PM
    Hello all,

    As always, fascinated to read any of these discussions, really are informative. As has been mentioned before, it is most certainly a delicate balancing act between commercial sustainability, artistic credibility and not appearing ridiculously musically aloof. Add to that the daily "challenge" of keeping the regulator happy too of course

    Would be happy to answer any Phantom 105.2 related questions you might have, or take any criticisms on board!

    Just while Im here too, if I may, I would like to plug our Advisory Board which is where we are inviting listeners to submit their views on what works well, and what works not so well on Phantom. Head along to Phantom.ie and sign up if you get a chance.

    Thanks!
    Simon Maher
    Phantom 105.2
    nerraw
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    2/20/2007 4:31 AM
    Really liking the station, definitely a breath of fresh air.

    But I do agree with some of the comments by Peejay that perhaps they are not being adventurous. The old stuff is generally something that is well known and played to death. Also a bit more variety when it comes to new bands rather than hammering their most well known song.

    But they're just small potatoes
    Binokular
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    2/20/2007 5:03 AM
    Prompted by this thread, I was listening to Phantom last night over t'interweb and it's pretty good you know, not perfect, but my idea of a perfect radio station would probably annoy the hell out of everyone else. If I could pick it up down here, I wouldn't complain. So, my only question is, why can't Phantom go national? People outside Dublin like indie too, none of the local radio stations in most counties appeal to that gap in the market.
    Garret
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    2/20/2007 5:12 AM
    a question best put to the BCI really
    Helmet
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    2/20/2007 6:41 AM
    Phantom got me turning off the ipod and turning on the radio in the car for the first time in about 3 years.
    A bit less Morrissy and REM and I'd be happy.
    Sinister Pete is great in the mornings, as is Jack Hyland.
    floodzer
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    2/20/2007 6:53 AM
    Something that I am wondering about is how exactly do the playlists work?
    There are a couple listed on the website, they are around 62/63 songs long and are all new music.
    But Phantom plays a fair whack that isnt on the list too. So is the playlist just a rough guide? And can they not play album tracks when it comes to new music?
    dudley
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    2/20/2007 7:13 AM
    i think in general the playlists are fine and suiting their purpose. getting the punters in, and different enough to other station output. that said, i'm not listening very much, there's not a lot for me there, and i'm a huge fan of alternative music. but generally, i'm glad it's there, particularly for the amount of airtime given to local bands, which has been absolutely fantastic, kudos to yer all.

    however, i think where there is definitely room for improvement, is more variety in late night specialist shows. follow the late 90's bbc radio 1 output, get a peelie in for properly underground/alternative music, get a kershaw in for yer world music, a westwood for yer hip hop etc.make it a rule that the playlists go out the window and must not contain material played during the daytime or something, though that's prob too extreme.

    way i see it, all the young folk that the daytime playlists suit are out at their youth clubs after 10pm, and old farts like me are sat at home with nothing to listen to on the wireless while we read our creation records biogs and supping on our horlicks.

    i don't know easy or charged the road ahead for phantom is going to be, but surely in years to come, if you fall foul of regulators or other bodies your remit for staying on air could only be balanced in your favour by saying, 'hey, look, we're a channel for a genuinely alternative music sources that don't get another outlet, you can't chop us!"

    give me a job
    Garret
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    2/20/2007 7:24 AM
    the playlists are a guideline for the presenters, and the rest is up to them

    there are %s that they have to keep (irish music, new music, playlist music, etc.)

    at least thats the way i believe the playlists work
    darren
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    2/20/2007 7:33 AM
    i'd love to see what dudley suggested regarding specialist shows. i actually thought that's what Phantom would be like when it came back. hopefully somewhere down the line anyway. 4 or 5 years ago i would've been delighted with Phantom as it is. nowadays i'll just put on the latest cd that comes free with foggy notions or plan b to hear some good music by bands i've never heard of. i would rather listen to a nice dj playing these songs if there was one though. if a specialist show like that was to happen too i'd hope it was on at a decent hour (eg. 10-12 or 12.30) and if it wasn't that there was some sort of podcast / option to stream the show in it's entirity after it's aired.
    rockchicklet
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    2/20/2007 11:32 AM
    the best thing they could do is just get all the Pixies and Muse and Smashing Pumpkins CDs and throw them away!

    There are a million things i'd change about phantom but at least, its better than fm104/today fm/2fm/98fm/spin/q102/add your own name to the list

    the best shows i've heard so far are on the weekend - i really like that Stadium Rock show (good mix of footie and indie anthems), sinead ni mohorda's classics show and the Kiosk with nadine o'regan. Think both Pearl (sunday mornings) and Jim caroll (saturday nights) should be on during the week - both of them are playing amazing music you dont hear on any other show on the station but which you SHOULD be hearing.

    Phantomfmdublin
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    2/20/2007 5:21 PM
    Rockchicklet, jaysus if we threw away all the Pixies and Muse and Pumpkins CDs we would be bankrupt in about 15 minutes. Like them or not, these are very popular artists and will always be the backbone of a commercial Alt Rock station. There really are some great shows at the weekends on Phantom, those mentioned above and more but for Phantom 105.2 to survive, it has to appeal to a broad audience with an interest in Alternative Rock.

    To answer other questions, the playlist you see on the site is the new music playlist. It covers the current "new" release material. This consists of singles and album tracks divided by category. The next layer down would be a stations "recurrents" which are the popular recent and older tracks. Then its the old songs and the unsigned and "breaking" tracks.

    On the specialist shows, we will continue to work on them and on providing shows that appeal to specific audiences. Like everything else, it takes time and as we get more established we can push the boundaries some more. Remember though, that we are only on air 14 weeks and our immediate priority is survival against some pretty big players and then development.

    Simon
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    2/20/2007 5:27 PM
    I really like Jim Carroll's show on Saturday nights, but I couldn't name any other particular shows as highlights. Those "backbone" bands also get on my nerves a little, but when they're playing new Irish stuff like Evil Harrisons and Heritage Centre, it's worth tuning in every now and again.
    rockchicklet
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    2/21/2007 1:48 AM
    Posted By Phantomfmdublin on 20 Feb 2007 5:21 PM
    Rockchicklet, jaysus if we threw away all the Pixies and Muse and Pumpkins CDs we would be bankrupt in about 15 minutes. Like them or not, these are very popular artists and will always be the backbone of a commercial Alt Rock station. There really are some great shows at the weekends on Phantom, those mentioned above and more but for Phantom 105.2 to survive, it has to appeal to a broad audience with an interest in Alternative Rock.




    "Broad audience" means an audience who are interested in more than just those dozen acts who are the backbone of the station. Dont get me wrong, i like all three acts mentioned above but not all the time.

    Posted By Phantomfmdublin on 20 Feb 2007 5:21 PM
    On the specialist shows, we will continue to work on them and on providing shows that appeal to specific audiences. Like everything else, it takes time and as we get more established we can push the boundaries some more. Remember though, that we are only on air 14 weeks and our immediate priority is survival against some pretty big players and then development.




    i may be alone on this but i find the specialist shows are all one kind of specialist - they all seem to be metal/industrial (bar the irish show and the Producers show). Why isnt there a specialist hip-hop show, a specialist dance-rock show, a specialist folk show? Theyre still all alternative rock

    I think the reason why people here have mentioned the weekend shows is because theyre so different to whats on at the daytime. That people are bothering to listen to the radio at the weekend and pick up shows like pearl's show and jim carroll's show means theres a demand for this kind of music during the week.

    as i said in my other posting, i'm a phantom fan and its a MILLION times better than anyting else on the dublin airwaves but it does sound like a station stuck in the 1990s a lot of the time.
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    2/21/2007 1:49 AM
    Posted By Phantomfmdublin on 20 Feb 2007 5:21 PM
    Rockchicklet, jaysus if we threw away all the Pixies and Muse and Pumpkins CDs we would be bankrupt in about 15 minutes. Like them or not, these are very popular artists and will always be the backbone of a commercial Alt Rock station. There really are some great shows at the weekends on Phantom, those mentioned above and more but for Phantom 105.2 to survive, it has to appeal to a broad audience with an interest in Alternative Rock.

    To answer other questions, the playlist you see on the site is the new music playlist. It covers the current "new" release material. This consists of singles and album tracks divided by category. The next layer down would be a stations "recurrents" which are the popular recent and older tracks. Then its the old songs and the unsigned and "breaking" tracks.

    On the specialist shows, we will continue to work on them and on providing shows that appeal to specific audiences. Like everything else, it takes time and as we get more established we can push the boundaries some more. Remember though, that we are only on air 14 weeks and our immediate priority is survival against some pretty big players and then development.

    Simon
    simonmaher@phantom.ie




    Do you mean specialist shows like for example Hip Hop, Goth or Heavy Metal? In a broad context the word "Alternative" should include these and not just your run of the mill Indie stuff.
    Ally
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    2/21/2007 1:53 AM
    Posted By Phantomfmdublin on 20 Feb 2007 5:21 PM

    On the specialist shows, we will continue to work on them and on providing shows that appeal to specific audiences. Like everything else, it takes time and as we get more established we can push the boundaries some more. Remember though, that we are only on air 14 weeks and our immediate priority is survival against some pretty big players and then development.

    Simon
    simonmaher@phantom.ie




    that'll do me.... seems reasonable

    although i think one of those boundaries to push could indeed be to introduce a genuinely alternative 10.00 P.M. to Midnight show during the week (or a once weekly 8.00 P.M. to 10.00 P.M. slot).... personally speaking, that evening slot has been the most disappointing thing... i can understand the need for the daytime fodder but the specialist shows lack a little bit of needed variety...

    on the whole though - well done - it's good to have you back
    Unicron
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    2/21/2007 3:38 AM
    Posted By Phantomfmdublin on 20 Feb 2007 5:21 PM
    Rockchicklet, jaysus if we threw away all the Pixies and Muse and Pumpkins CDs we would be bankrupt in about 15 minutes. Like them or not, these are very popular artists and will always be the backbone of a commercial Alt Rock station. There really are some great shows at the weekends on Phantom, those mentioned above and more but for Phantom 105.2 to survive, it has to appeal to a broad audience with an interest in Alternative Rock.



    I think you're relying on the backbone a bit too much though. I love the Pixies but everytime I hear them on the station I go "aw no not again." The best part of Phantom for me is hearing new things, I'm listening to Edel right now and she played "Heart Shaped Box" (which I love) and something that I'd never heard before, I preferred hearing the song I didn't no. Also, less bad NME approved British bands (Tap Tap are the only decent new band from the UK I've heard since the first Doves record in 2001) and more "pitchfork bands", if Sufjan Stevens and Arcade Fire can have big audiences here then surely there's a market for hearing more of that sort of thing.
    Binokular
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    2/21/2007 4:13 AM
    No idea what phantom is like day to day, but I was listening to it the other night on t'interweb and they were playing Delta 5 who have been covered by Chicks on Speed, so it was interesting to hear the originals and prompted me to track them down on Emusic so it's pretty good.

    I dunno, more Italdisco?
    Punchbowl
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    2/21/2007 4:20 AM
    The unfortunate thing is that Phantom offers itself up to Goths and Metal heads WAY too much.. As far as I can see 'alternative' music is now predominantly electro and anthemic indie. The Pixies obviously surface quite a bit on Phantom and they deserve their place at the table, but not to take all the seats. Anyone just has to surf Pitchfork or Last Fm and see the bands that are making waves right now.

    Again, a lot of posters here are concentrating on the fact that it's better than what's out there, that's just not good enough. Phantom is populated by the masters of a legacy of a pirate station that came when the kids wanted to rock.. The kids have now grown up, Ash aren't relevant and Metal is a memory. (Remember, Phantom arose when indie was not in the mainstream. it is now. Bloc Party, Arcade Fire get played on all stations, but that's not reason for Phantom not to play them..)

    I'm not going to do up a sample playlist because the info is out there for all to see, but for inspiration check Tom Dunne's Pet Sounds (particularly last nights Dave Couse helmed one) and Donal Dineens late night bliss. I would urge them to do so, because this little niche that they carved out when Wexford St was beginning to hop is becoming narrower and narrower and they are in danger of ruining it for us all (ie proving that alternative radio doesn't work and thus being replaced with commercial)

    In a short, Phantom needs to stop looking to Whelan's and start listening to music.

    Dave
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    2/21/2007 4:44 AM
    Inspiration and Tom Dunne in the same sentence?

    He plays the same turgid stuff all the time. He show is the most unspiring on radio today. Even friends who are fans are turning off his show in droves. You immediately know your listening to Tom Dunne from the playlist. As for the hilarious name that tune someone's humming.

    Of course, horses for courses.
    Ally
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    2/21/2007 5:02 AM
    the last few posts have been wrong...

    ...i hate listening to endless pixies / smashing pumpkins / 90's rock just as much as all of you but these bands still attract WAY more listeners than even some of the more succesful "pitchfork bands" (as unicron described them... by the way, last decent UK album is from 2001 - where have you been, sir?)... they have to think of listening figures first and foremost at the beginning...

    the evening time needs the good alternative music (and i don't mean a specialist genre show - music doesn't need to be categorised this way)... you have jim carroll and pearl at the weekend... you could do with a foggy notions show during the week... or a donal dineen...
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    2/21/2007 5:23 AM
    Posted By Punchbowl on 21 Feb 2007 4:20 AM
    The unfortunate thing is that Phantom offers itself up to Goths and Metal heads WAY too much.. As far as I can see 'alternative' music is now predominantly electro and anthemic indie. The Pixies obviously surface quite a bit on Phantom and they deserve their place at the table, but not to take all the seats. Anyone just has to surf Pitchfork or Last Fm and see the bands that are making waves right now.

    Again, a lot of posters here are concentrating on the fact that it's better than what's out there, that's just not good enough. Phantom is populated by the masters of a legacy of a pirate station that came when the kids wanted to rock.. The kids have now grown up, Ash aren't relevant and Metal is a memory. (Remember, Phantom arose when indie was not in the mainstream. it is now. Bloc Party, Arcade Fire get played on all stations, but that's not reason for Phantom not to play them..)

    I'm not going to do up a sample playlist because the info is out there for all to see, but for inspiration check Tom Dunne's Pet Sounds (particularly last nights Dave Couse helmed one) and Donal Dineens late night bliss. I would urge them to do so, because this little niche that they carved out when Wexford St was beginning to hop is becoming narrower and narrower and they are in danger of ruining it for us all (ie proving that alternative radio doesn't work and thus being replaced with commercial)

    In a short, Phantom needs to stop looking to Whelan's and start listening to music.

    Dave




    great post, great great post
    Binokular
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    2/21/2007 5:38 AM
    Posted By Punchbowl on 21 Feb 2007 4:20 AM
    The unfortunate thing is that Phantom offers itself up to Goths and Metal heads WAY too much.. As far as I can see 'alternative' music is now predominantly electro and anthemic indie.




    This is so true of many alternative shows, look at MTV2, loadsa fallout boy/My Chemical Romance/Muse, the kind of stuff 15 year old skate kids in Nirvana hoodies probably regard as "REAL music", wheres the non-rock in the vein of Saint Ettienne, why do I have to wait until late at night for 120 minutes?

    As for alternative is predominantly electro and and anthemic indie, yeah sort of, but I kinda feel the "electro" bit is generally an indiefied NYC/UK/French version of electro, the timeline of Electro history for it's audience sorta goes straight from Kraftwerk to post-Electroclash sorta stuff, neatly bypassing the rich vein of everything inbetween electros second wave as a part of hip-hop and even early electroclash era stuff. Don't want to sound snobbish here, electro has always been a fluid genre that's been re-invented time and again and a lot of the current wave (e.g. Justtice)is fantastic, but some of it feels like indie bands with keyboards trying to make themselves sound more progressive than they are by nailing on the Electro tag almost as an afterthought. It's sorta like the NME inventing the Nu-Rave tag, implying a comeback because a UK band were doing something vaguely rave-y, while ignoring mainland Europe

    As for the anthemic indie thing, is that a good trend? I mean everybody likes an anthem but it seems every band seems to be trying to produce a massively "important" epic these days. Some of this is good, some sounds like a bunch of bad Bruce Springsteen wannabes, and what is the obsession with The Boss anyway? I always remember his as being OK, but slightly naff when I was growing up. What about the charm of indie records that don't try to be epic, but sound small and amateur in good way? Along the lines of the Damaged Goods label for example?

    I guess what I'm trying to say is it can be good to be aware of these trends but not to be over-influenced by them. Theres also an obsession with "new" music these days, but to me new music is simply something I haven't heard before even if it was recorded in 1978, always nice when a radio show mixes new releases with a bit of crate-digging, which judging by what I've heard on Phantom, does appear to happen even if occasionally.
    Unicron
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    2/21/2007 5:43 AM
    Posted By Ally on 21 Feb 2007 5:02 AM

    ...i hate listening to endless pixies / smashing pumpkins / 90's rock just as much as all of you but these bands still attract WAY more listeners than even some of the more succesful "pitchfork bands" (as unicron described them... by the way, last decent UK album is from 2001 - where have you been, sir?)...




    By a new band. There's been good albums by more established UK acts since then but up until Tap Tap put out their album last year I hadn't heard an exciting British debut since Lost Souls. Of course if you care to suggest some more I'll investigate but the whole nu-(post)-punk thing bores me terribly. I've got Mission Of Burma and Gang Of 4 albums that I can listen to that are good if I want to hear that sort of thing.

    Oh wait, that pipettes album, it's alright.
    Ally
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    2/21/2007 9:23 AM
    Posted By Binokular on 21 Feb 2007 5:38 AM

    As for the anthemic indie thing, is that a good trend? I mean everybody likes an anthem but it seems every band seems to be trying to produce a massively "important" epic these days. What about the charm of indie records that don't try to be epic, but sound small and amateur in good way? Along the lines of the Damaged Goods label for example?





    this is exactly where i'm at...
    Ally
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    2/21/2007 9:35 AM
    Posted By Unicron on 21 Feb 2007 5:43 AM
    By a new band. There's been good albums by more established UK acts since then but up until Tap Tap put out their album last year I hadn't heard an exciting British debut since Lost Souls. Of course if you care to suggest some more I'll investigate but the whole nu-(post)-punk thing bores me terribly. I've got Mission Of Burma and Gang Of 4 albums that I can listen to that are good if I want to hear that sort of thing.

    Oh wait, that pipettes album, it's alright.


    i agree with a lot of the post punk think but still, c'mon!...

    brakes
    minotaur shock
    various
    the fence collective
    patrick wolf
    antony and the johnsons (well, he did win the mercury thingy)
    any number of twee indiepop stuff
    any number of avant-garde free folkists
    lone pigeon
    sons and daughters

    i don't know, it's not as if i love some of these bands, they just came into my head (that said, i'm struggling to come up with the "big" indie band)...

    it appears you are caught up in the american scene via pitchfork and the like... but there is plenty of good british music out there...

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    2/21/2007 9:45 AM
    Ok, I'm only back from my Cluas sabbatical so I'm not too good with the Quoting but in response to Binokular.

    I agree with Electro being a flowing genre and that it lends itself to others, and in a way, I guess you're right about it becoming indiefied. So rather than concentrate on it's bastardisation by UK and Irish acts, could it not be defined as a sub genre, indietronica or what not? The point I was making anyway, was that Phantom seem to prefer the dark over the light. A lot of indie/electro meddling can sound amateur and quirky and Phantom has traditionally shied away from this, which is a pity. But because of it's throwaway nature, it's gets thrown away.

    In context, the Pixies would sound a lot better with a good cross section of newer acts. Then these older songs can rightly be elevated to classic status, and would also serve as benchmarks in modern taste, in case we lose the run of ourselves (Razorlight).

    Regarding Anthemic rock. I used the wrong term. I got lazy. But you know what I mean. I certainly didn't want to refer to it as emotional rock. There is I suppose an argument for Intelligent Indie Music and I simply feel that Phantom have not produced the good in this department.

    As a closing note, Phantom was a huge part of my early 20's and I'll always thanks it for that. But, I really wanted it to be a part of my early 30's too.. And it's not doing that I'm afraid.

    Dave
    Unicron
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    2/21/2007 10:00 AM
    Posted By Ally on 21 Feb 2007 9:35 AM
    i agree with a lot of the post punk think but still, c'mon!...

    brakes
    minotaur shock
    various
    the fence collective
    patrick wolf
    antony and the johnsons (well, he did win the mercury thingy)
    any number of twee indiepop stuff
    any number of avant-garde free folkists
    lone pigeon
    sons and daughters

    it appears you are caught up in the american scene via pitchfork and the like... but there is plenty of good british music out there...

    Oh Zing. I don't care for pitchfork that much in terms of writing but they've turned me onto enough decent stuff in the past that I'll check out whatever they recommend but not dismiss what they don't like. As for your list, I don't rate Brakes, Patrick Wolf or Sons And Daughters; Antony who I think is wonderful is, mercury aside, effectively an American act. I've liked what I've heard of Minotaur Shock though. Not heard the others.

    It's not that I'm closed to the idea of good British acts, a nation of 65 million people with such a rich heritage can't just have started universally churning out s**te en masse because the NME began liking bad music but I know of no decent place I can go to read about good British music. I only got broadband last week so maybe now it'll be easier for me to find good stuff.
    Ally
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    2/21/2007 10:08 AM
    Posted By Unicron on 21 Feb 2007 10:00 AM


    It's not that I'm closed to the idea of good British acts, a nation of 65 million people with such a rich heritage can't just have started universally churning out s**te en masse because the NME began liking bad music but I know of no decent place I can go to read about good British music. I only got broadband last week so maybe now it'll be easier for me to find good stuff.




    true... harder to find decent sources... i guess with webzines such as pitchfork, stylus, popmatters, tinymixtapes etc... there is always a tendency to american releases... was just a bold statement... and i'm kinda pissed off by these quirky american indie-rock bands at the moment (huge generalisation i realise)...

    anyway, phantom - i think punchbowl is talking sense but i also think that we can all get caught up in how many people actually listen to the stuff we listen to... because we hang around these forums, we presume there are millions... but the teenagers rule and they like to hear the smashing pumpkins and nirvana...
    The_Pen15
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    2/21/2007 10:09 AM
    I don't listen to the radio ever
    Unicron
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    2/21/2007 11:21 AM
    Posted By Ally on 21 Feb 2007 10:08 AM
    Posted By Unicron on 21 Feb 2007 10:00 AM


    It's not that I'm closed to the idea of good British acts, a nation of 65 million people with such a rich heritage can't just have started universally churning out s**te en masse because the NME began liking bad music but I know of no decent place I can go to read about good British music. I only got broadband last week so maybe now it'll be easier for me to find good stuff.




    true... harder to find decent sources... i guess with webzines such as pitchfork, stylus, popmatters, tinymixtapes etc... there is always a tendency to american releases... was just a bold statement... and i'm kinda pissed off by these quirky american indie-rock bands at the moment (huge generalisation i realise)...

    anyway, phantom - i think punchbowl is talking sense but i also think that we can all get caught up in how many people actually listen to the stuff we listen to... because we hang around these forums, we presume there are millions... but the teenagers rule and they like to hear the smashing pumpkins and nirvana...




    I have more money to spend than teenagers do. Cater to me Simon. MEEEEEEEEEEEEE
    dermot_trellis
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    2/21/2007 10:04 PM
    re: new British bands - I agree with Unicron in that I haven't really heard any new British groups in 4 or 5 years that have really impressed me.. all the new music I've really enjoyed for quite a while has been American or occasionally continental European. I'm sure there are great British new bands out there, but we're not hearing about them.. (Actually, that new Patrick Wolf album is pretty good, so he's possibly an exception to this).

    About Phantom, I haven't given it enough listening time since it came back on to give a proper opinion on how they've done.. A few very good specialist shows in the evenings and tolerable daytime playlists would be all I'd really want.. I haven't really listened to music radio since I discovered Newstalk, and I don't even listen to that all that much.
    klootfan
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    2/22/2007 2:05 AM
    I haven't really listened to music radio since I discovered Newstalk, and I don't even listen to that all that much.

    Weird, but News Talk had the same effect for me...
    Eric
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    2/23/2007 3:45 AM
    I really like Sinister Pete in the mornings - a breath of fresh air from the other crap being played on the other stations at that time. I particularly like the weather report!
    Also, agreed, Pearl is great on Sunday mornings - she always sounds so wrecked



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